Yes, actually, someone arbitrarily deciding what makes someone an artist is by definition gatekeeping.
Have a look at Dwarf Fortress. How many textures and models
Quite a lot? This it has lots of art in it? Its just pixel art? Youre not making the point you think you’re making there.
…if you know game design, have no other art skills, and no team…
This whole paragraph wasnt really relevant to the conversation so im just moving past it if thats okay?
In case you think “I’m just going to throw AI images at my VN” – valid choice.
This is a false dichotomy. Your options are not either put in the effort with traditional art or lazily throw any random AI generated images at your game. You can put time and effort into AI images, to make them have a consistent style and to actually fit what are trying to make. The latest background im making for my game, for example, has taken me well over an hour already and its not quite finished, but its still orders of magnitude faster and better than if I drew it myself
Which is the entire point of my comment. If I had to rely on my own artistic skill or have to pay money I dont have to get art made, then I simply would not have been able to make the game I want to make. Even if I did what you suggested and designed around my lack of artistic skill, that would be a different game than the one I wanted to make. Thats why im saying AI art is a good thing and makes art more accessible. I simply would not be making my game, expressing my creativity and enjoying myself if it wasnt for the ability to generate AI art pieces.
Zero. Dwarf fortress has zero textures and models, at least the base version that generated the cult following, by now there’s some extensions. It’s rendering to console, not with some 3d API, how would it even use those textures and models? It also doesn’t contain pixel art (past the intro screen) same as a street map is not line art.
Seeing that you got such a basic thing completely wrong I do not believe you for one second that you’re anywhere close to being a gamedev. Or even programmer. Maybe you’re a hobbyist trying to write your first game, in that case be aware that your first ten are going to suck get them out of your system as quickly as possible, don’t settle. Move quickly and abandon things.
You can put time and effort into AI images, to make them have a consistent style and to actually fit what are trying to make.
Nothing I said contradicts that. That time and effort, to make it fit what you’re trying to make, is an artistic endeavour, all I did was give pointers on how to get better at that stuff.
Even if I did what you suggested and designed around my lack of artistic skill, that would be a different game than the one I wanted to make.
That’s not what I suggested. What I suggested was making a conscious, deliberate, informed, choice. Not saying “I want to make a science-based dragon MMO with photorealistic graphics” but “Here’s my options, here’s what I can do, here’s what I can learn in a reasonable amount of time, let’s see what option I like best”. Make a decision matrix if you have to.
expressing my creativity and enjoying myself
One thing art is not about is enjoyment. I mean it can come with the process but the opposite can be true as well.
Zero. Dwarf fortress has zero textures and models, at least the base version that generated the cult following
The only version ive seen is the steam version that actually has sprites
seeing that you got such a basic thing completely wrong I do not believe you for one second that you’re anywhere close to being a gamedev. Or even programmer.
lmao, fuck off.
One thing art is not about is enjoyment.
What in the actual fuck are you talking about? Theres is 0 chance you actually believe that.
Literrally what the fuck is the point of any of your comments besides being a troll?
The only version ive seen is the steam version that actually has sprites
Tiles are neither textures nor models1. The OG thing, also the one that’s in the MOMA, could render to an ANSI terminal.
lmao, fuck off.
…I mean, how long have you been around and how deep did you go that you don’t know that DF has existed for ages (2006)? It’s one of the standards. It’s like calling yourself a movie director but not having seen Seven Samurai.
What in the actual fuck are you talking about? Theres is 0 chance you actually believe that.
The tortured artist is literally a trope by now, though the boundaries to Faustian characters is often blurry. Art is expressive. It can be hedonistic but then because the artist is a hedonist, not because hedonism would make it art.
Literrally what the fuck is the point of any of your comments besides being a troll?
Art. I’m trying to get some basic art education into your skull so that your games won’t be, at best, trite slop with questionable mechanics. Producing something great is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration, if you think you can get away with 1% inspiration and 99% masturbation you’re in for a rude awakening on release. “Oh no material reality is impinging on my vision”, great, another escapist. Touch paint. Or admit that you’re dabbling. I’ll still grant you the artist title but it’ll be in the shoddy category: If you want to create art, fucking care about art.
1 except in a very technical sense when you write a tiler engine using 3d APIs because any grid of values is a texture in that terminology.
Yes, actually, someone arbitrarily deciding what makes someone an artist is by definition gatekeeping.
Quite a lot? This it has lots of art in it? Its just pixel art? Youre not making the point you think you’re making there.
This whole paragraph wasnt really relevant to the conversation so im just moving past it if thats okay?
This is a false dichotomy. Your options are not either put in the effort with traditional art or lazily throw any random AI generated images at your game. You can put time and effort into AI images, to make them have a consistent style and to actually fit what are trying to make. The latest background im making for my game, for example, has taken me well over an hour already and its not quite finished, but its still orders of magnitude faster and better than if I drew it myself
Which is the entire point of my comment. If I had to rely on my own artistic skill or have to pay money I dont have to get art made, then I simply would not have been able to make the game I want to make. Even if I did what you suggested and designed around my lack of artistic skill, that would be a different game than the one I wanted to make. Thats why im saying AI art is a good thing and makes art more accessible. I simply would not be making my game, expressing my creativity and enjoying myself if it wasnt for the ability to generate AI art pieces.
Zero. Dwarf fortress has zero textures and models, at least the base version that generated the cult following, by now there’s some extensions. It’s rendering to console, not with some 3d API, how would it even use those textures and models? It also doesn’t contain pixel art (past the intro screen) same as a street map is not line art.
Seeing that you got such a basic thing completely wrong I do not believe you for one second that you’re anywhere close to being a gamedev. Or even programmer. Maybe you’re a hobbyist trying to write your first game, in that case be aware that your first ten are going to suck get them out of your system as quickly as possible, don’t settle. Move quickly and abandon things.
Nothing I said contradicts that. That time and effort, to make it fit what you’re trying to make, is an artistic endeavour, all I did was give pointers on how to get better at that stuff.
That’s not what I suggested. What I suggested was making a conscious, deliberate, informed, choice. Not saying “I want to make a science-based dragon MMO with photorealistic graphics” but “Here’s my options, here’s what I can do, here’s what I can learn in a reasonable amount of time, let’s see what option I like best”. Make a decision matrix if you have to.
One thing art is not about is enjoyment. I mean it can come with the process but the opposite can be true as well.
The only version ive seen is the steam version that actually has sprites
lmao, fuck off.
What in the actual fuck are you talking about? Theres is 0 chance you actually believe that.
Literrally what the fuck is the point of any of your comments besides being a troll?
Tiles are neither textures nor models1. The OG thing, also the one that’s in the MOMA, could render to an ANSI terminal.
…I mean, how long have you been around and how deep did you go that you don’t know that DF has existed for ages (2006)? It’s one of the standards. It’s like calling yourself a movie director but not having seen Seven Samurai.
The tortured artist is literally a trope by now, though the boundaries to Faustian characters is often blurry. Art is expressive. It can be hedonistic but then because the artist is a hedonist, not because hedonism would make it art.
Art. I’m trying to get some basic art education into your skull so that your games won’t be, at best, trite slop with questionable mechanics. Producing something great is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration, if you think you can get away with 1% inspiration and 99% masturbation you’re in for a rude awakening on release. “Oh no material reality is impinging on my vision”, great, another escapist. Touch paint. Or admit that you’re dabbling. I’ll still grant you the artist title but it’ll be in the shoddy category: If you want to create art, fucking care about art.
1 except in a very technical sense when you write a tiler engine using 3d APIs because any grid of values is a texture in that terminology.