And that still doesn’t answer my question. You are stating facts. I’m not arguing that. What I’m simply asking is if this is worth the US getting into a hot war with Russia using nukes over? It very literally would bring WW3 and nuclear Armageddon. That is the plain and simple fact when the US commits troops to this quagmire. Are you personally prepared to die in a nuclear explosion in the name of protecting Ukraine’s sovereignty?
But by all means, keep deflecting with irrelevant facts. It’s the sort of thing someone does when they have nothing intelligent to say
So you are personally prepared to die over a few regions in Ukraine that want to be Russian? Do your friends and family know you’d like them to die or suffer a nuclear apocalypse so some insignificant corner of the world can finally be free from Russia, Ukraine, and Modern Civilization?
Sounds like you didn’t pay attention to 20th century history so here’s the cliff items:
Nuclear war = very bad. No winners. Most die. Civilization collapses. Mad max ensues
If defending Ukraine from Russia will lead to nuclear warfare then failure to defend Ukraine will lead defending the US, which will lead to nuclear warfare. Putin has demonstrated that nothing will ever be enough for him. Remember when we tried letting him have what he wanted? That’s how we ended up here.
failure to defend Ukraine will lead defending the US, which will lead to nuclear warfare
What? That makes zero sense. You do realize that when the US, a nuclear power, enters troops into the Ukrainian conflict backing Ukraine, Russia, another nuclear power, will directly declare war on the us and that war will very quickly escalate into a nuclear exchange.
I think you’re trying to say in some deranged way that if the us does nothing Russia will somehow decide to keep going (even though it’s proven they are having difficulty in Ukraine) and pick up more countries until they get to the us and decide to nuke it?
You seem to think this is exactly like WW2 and Hitler but only superficially. Like you heard the WW2 talking points and distilled them into perfectly fitting here. Which yes, one country invading another is a similarity. However it’s a similarity with almost literally every conflict in the world.
Screw Russia. They’re pathethic and getting a taste of their own medicine.
So will you if a nuclear war is triggered. Do you really think protecting Ukraine’s sovereignty is worth burning down the world in an exchange of nuclear weapons?
You made the mistake of misunderstanding that, then I clarified and you’re here AGAIN making the same mistake. Completely on purpose. – I’ve made it clear in multiple posts that I live in Brazil, I’ve made no effort to hide that, I mention Brazil often and how you Americans should take a cue from us since we’ve actually made our Trump ineligible and we’ll send him to prison soon.
But sadly we are strongly affected by all the mistakes you idiots do.
If China sent 3k troops to Cuba I wouldn’t care. 83k would be alarming because a sudden change from 0 presence to a demographic group would make me worry China was invading Cuba.
83k is a lot more than 3k. But you knew what when you started arguing in bad faith.
The only people upset about this are those that want Putin to win.
A guy walks into my house and stabs my wife. He starts eating the food out of my refrigerator. I don’t call the police, because I wouldn’t want to provoke him.
Thanks for reducing the complexity of international politics to something I’d expect from a late night TV bizarre true crime documentary. You’ve certainly elevated the debate!
US sends troops to other country saying that they’re doing it for good and benevolent reasons -> a decade later we find out that they did war crimes there
There were protests, undeniable. Initially there were peaceful protests from people who had reservations about Deng’s policies, that the CPC openly engaged with. Li Peng met with these protestors in April. However, the CIA saw the opportunity to forment an uprising and so pushed several student “leaders” into more aggressive actions. “Leaders” who expressed motivations such as wanting China to be controlled by the West.
Even western sources at the time, including ones such as the NYT and Reuters, said that there wasn’t much happening. In the Square itself, there were no casulities. In the entirety of Beijing there were casulties among the PLA, police, and protestors alike. PLA soldiers were unarmed until they were attacked by protestors.
In the square itself the tank (which was leaving the square, not entering) stopped for the infamous tank man, who then…walked away unharmed. Do you think that would happen in many other countries? Considering we see US police charging full speed through protestors, I certainly don’t.
Your are poorly mistaken. There are plenty of gorey pictures and videos of lots of dead and dying protesters in Tiennemen Square from that day. Thousands were killed according to many witnesses.
Out of curiosity, are you referring to that black and white photo of the “bodies” that gets passed around a lot? The one that is actually just a bunch of bicycles?
If you need an eyewitness account from a non-Chinese source, by all means: https://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/89BEIJING18828_a.html
Some beatings, which obviously criticism could be levied at, by otherwise unarmed riot police, but not much more than that.
There definitely was violence on both sides, even the official counts put the casulties around 200 last I checked. Which were sadly probably preventable had the PLA been equipped with nonlethal control measures rather than…nothing.
I do credit your link as it surprisingly shows the violence both ways, a lot of modern sources like to paint it as being very one-sided. One thing I did notice even in the Esquire article you linked, they explicitly never mention Tiananmen in any of the pictures showing violence. Because, like in the account I linked, there was no violence in Tiananmen Square. Now if you said “Hey, there were outbreaks of violence around Beijing on June 4th” yes, that would be true. Even the CPC official accounts don’t deny that.
Like I said, from april to the beginning of june, initial protests were fairly peaceful and the CPC engaged with them, PLA on site had no weapons initially. Which is definitely an area they messed up, as they may have been able to further limit casulties if they could have responded faster.
The fact that CIA had embedded agents in the protestors and collaborated with the mafia is not exactly a secret, Operation Yellowbird is fairly well known, and that is basically their MO to begin with.
You say that but if China established some “mutual contracts” with Cuba or Canada and started placing thousands of troops there and even moving nukes near the US, you guys would start an all out war.
It’s OK guys, America isn’t provoking a war or anything like that.
Just tell, has a war EVER started because America was sending troops and building military bases where they shouldn’t?
‘provoking a war’ Russia invaded Ukraine, thus provoking war.
I want to see your reaction when China puts 83k troops in Cuba.
Nah, I know exactly what you’re going to say.
Russia invaded Ukraine, thus provoking war.
And is that worth the US involvement going hot and dragging the whole world into nuclear warfare?
Russia invaded Ukraine, thus provoking war
That doesn’t answer my question, and demonstrates a lack of critical thinking
Did you know that Russia invaded Ukraine? Did you know Russia invaded Georgia? Did you know Russia invaded Crimea?
You and your questions, playing some fantasy game of Risk, but in the future…can get bent.
did you know that sending the goddamn US military there probably is going to make shit so much worse for civilians on both sides?
like why do you think we’re going there for peaceful and benevolent reasons? We have literally never done that before.
And that still doesn’t answer my question. You are stating facts. I’m not arguing that. What I’m simply asking is if this is worth the US getting into a hot war with Russia using nukes over? It very literally would bring WW3 and nuclear Armageddon. That is the plain and simple fact when the US commits troops to this quagmire. Are you personally prepared to die in a nuclear explosion in the name of protecting Ukraine’s sovereignty?
But by all means, keep deflecting with irrelevant facts. It’s the sort of thing someone does when they have nothing intelligent to say
he or she also act like a bot, repeating itself over and over.
Russia invaded Ukraine (I am not a bot). thus provoking war
Yes.
So you are personally prepared to die over a few regions in Ukraine that want to be Russian? Do your friends and family know you’d like them to die or suffer a nuclear apocalypse so some insignificant corner of the world can finally be free from Russia, Ukraine, and Modern Civilization?
Sounds like you didn’t pay attention to 20th century history so here’s the cliff items:
Nuclear war = very bad. No winners. Most die. Civilization collapses. Mad max ensues
Yes.
☢️ take
If defending Ukraine from Russia will lead to nuclear warfare then failure to defend Ukraine will lead defending the US, which will lead to nuclear warfare. Putin has demonstrated that nothing will ever be enough for him. Remember when we tried letting him have what he wanted? That’s how we ended up here.
What? That makes zero sense. You do realize that when the US, a nuclear power, enters troops into the Ukrainian conflict backing Ukraine, Russia, another nuclear power, will directly declare war on the us and that war will very quickly escalate into a nuclear exchange.
I think you’re trying to say in some deranged way that if the us does nothing Russia will somehow decide to keep going (even though it’s proven they are having difficulty in Ukraine) and pick up more countries until they get to the us and decide to nuke it?
You seem to think this is exactly like WW2 and Hitler but only superficially. Like you heard the WW2 talking points and distilled them into perfectly fitting here. Which yes, one country invading another is a similarity. However it’s a similarity with almost literally every conflict in the world.
Oh yeah, the invader is a nuclear power…everyone let them invade!
No. Screw Russia. They’re pathethic and getting a taste of their own medicine.
So will you if a nuclear war is triggered. Do you really think protecting Ukraine’s sovereignty is worth burning down the world in an exchange of nuclear weapons?
Ukraine is the United States of America ?
If they did it after we initiated war next to cuba, then I wouldn’t be surprised at all?
The US has been building military bases and positioning troops all over Russia for a veeery long time now, friend.
Oh really? Can you name some of these US military bases within Russia?
Aren’t you the guy that claimed you lived in the US and then claimed you live in Brazil just minutes later in a different post yesterday?
I never claimed I live in the USA.
You made the mistake of misunderstanding that, then I clarified and you’re here AGAIN making the same mistake. Completely on purpose. – I’ve made it clear in multiple posts that I live in Brazil, I’ve made no effort to hide that, I mention Brazil often and how you Americans should take a cue from us since we’ve actually made our Trump ineligible and we’ll send him to prison soon.
But sadly we are strongly affected by all the mistakes you idiots do.
Link me to your clarification post because I never saw it. All I saw from you was a link to globalization on Wikipedia.
Hey can you repost your actual reply to the question at hand? I still haven’t seen a logical response.
He was stalking me so I blocked him, can you copy-paste his post?
If China sent 3k troops to Cuba I wouldn’t care. 83k would be alarming because a sudden change from 0 presence to a demographic group would make me worry China was invading Cuba.
83k is a lot more than 3k. But you knew what when you started arguing in bad faith.
The only people upset about this are those that want Putin to win.
LOL
Ok, so China puts 3k troops on Cuba every month, is that fine now?
It also makes a deal with Canada and starts building military bases all around the US.
Provoking war with whom. Russia is already at war with Ukraine lmao. Maybe dont start a war if you dont want war provoking bla bla
A guy walks into my house and stabs my wife. He starts eating the food out of my refrigerator. I don’t call the police, because I wouldn’t want to provoke him.
Fuck entirely off shill.
Thanks for reducing the complexity of international politics to something I’d expect from a late night TV bizarre true crime documentary. You’ve certainly elevated the debate!
sometimes an invasion by a genocidal foreign power is just an invasion by a genocidal foreign power
it kind of tends to be a pattern in retrospect
US sends troops to other country saying that they’re doing it for good and benevolent reasons -> a decade later we find out that they did war crimes there
deleted by creator
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSbx352cn8A
The continuation of the screenshot you guys like so much
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=vSbx352cn8A
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source, check me out at GitHub.
There were protests, undeniable. Initially there were peaceful protests from people who had reservations about Deng’s policies, that the CPC openly engaged with. Li Peng met with these protestors in April. However, the CIA saw the opportunity to forment an uprising and so pushed several student “leaders” into more aggressive actions. “Leaders” who expressed motivations such as wanting China to be controlled by the West.
Even western sources at the time, including ones such as the NYT and Reuters, said that there wasn’t much happening. In the Square itself, there were no casulities. In the entirety of Beijing there were casulties among the PLA, police, and protestors alike. PLA soldiers were unarmed until they were attacked by protestors.
In the square itself the tank (which was leaving the square, not entering) stopped for the infamous tank man, who then…walked away unharmed. Do you think that would happen in many other countries? Considering we see US police charging full speed through protestors, I certainly don’t.
Your are poorly mistaken. There are plenty of gorey pictures and videos of lots of dead and dying protesters in Tiennemen Square from that day. Thousands were killed according to many witnesses.
Out of curiosity, are you referring to that black and white photo of the “bodies” that gets passed around a lot? The one that is actually just a bunch of bicycles?
If you need an eyewitness account from a non-Chinese source, by all means: https://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/89BEIJING18828_a.html Some beatings, which obviously criticism could be levied at, by otherwise unarmed riot police, but not much more than that.
I’ve seen more photos somewhere, but #12 shows a students brains and a Chinese army helmet. https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/g36621881/tiananmen-square-massacre-photos/
There definitely was violence on both sides, even the official counts put the casulties around 200 last I checked. Which were sadly probably preventable had the PLA been equipped with nonlethal control measures rather than…nothing.
I do credit your link as it surprisingly shows the violence both ways, a lot of modern sources like to paint it as being very one-sided. One thing I did notice even in the Esquire article you linked, they explicitly never mention Tiananmen in any of the pictures showing violence. Because, like in the account I linked, there was no violence in Tiananmen Square. Now if you said “Hey, there were outbreaks of violence around Beijing on June 4th” yes, that would be true. Even the CPC official accounts don’t deny that.
Thanks for the giving me my giant dose of BS for the day.
deleted by creator
Like I said, from april to the beginning of june, initial protests were fairly peaceful and the CPC engaged with them, PLA on site had no weapons initially. Which is definitely an area they messed up, as they may have been able to further limit casulties if they could have responded faster.
The fact that CIA had embedded agents in the protestors and collaborated with the mafia is not exactly a secret, Operation Yellowbird is fairly well known, and that is basically their MO to begin with.
Taiwan #1
“where they shouldn’t” it’s not like they land in Germany and demand to build a fucking base. It’s a mutual contract between the two nations dumb ass
You say that but if China established some “mutual contracts” with Cuba or Canada and started placing thousands of troops there and even moving nukes near the US, you guys would start an all out war.