That’s the entire point of the saying. You dont get shot with a nice word and a gun because you’re not unarmed. The reference to “nice word” in the second half is like saying, “you could try to wash dishes with good thoughts, but good thoughts and scrubbing with soap and water is more effective.”
You do know there are places where there is actual conflict happening and there is actual attempted revolution, correct? You seem to be thinking about this from a strictly “upper class western” pov where people who’ve never shot a gun in their lives carry one around because they watched YouTube videos. That’s not what’s being discussed here.
I hope anyone that touches a firearm drops dead on the spot. I don’t need adults with the mindset of a 8 year old in this world. I’m not debating anyone defending fire arms.
@ackzsel@seahorse@Jaytreeman ah yes, marginalized people who are regularly threatened by violence, armed fascists, and the state being willing to use firearms to defend themselves and their right to exist are totally the ones with the mentality of an 8-year-old, not the person who thinks we should literally just roll over and let people beat us up and murder us and eliminate us from public life in order to preserve some perfect pacifist moral high ground because firearms are an ooo spooky evil shibboleth only “bad guys” touch and “all violence is bad.” Thinking all violence, even in self-defense, is bad regardless of the context is totally a mature and well thought through position and not an overly simplistic view of how morality works. Believing that using a specific implement of violence is bad simply because a group you don’t like likes that tool is totally adult thinking. Believing in pure pacifism in the face of genocidal evil as if that’s in any way practical or moral is totally a nuanced adult view of the world and not the most simplistic 5-year-old understanding of morality that you get from children’s cartoons.
@ackzsel@seahorse@Jaytreeman seriously, when the level of your thinking is “guns bad and anyone who uses them is evil” you don’t get to accuse other people of having a child-like view of the world lol
Question for you: would you rather all the guns be in the hands of the government? Because guns won’t disappear due to your wish. In countries all over the world, conflict is very real and not having guns would mean utter defeat for those fighting against fascists.
We get it, it would be a different world if guns were never invented. But they have been. And relinquishing that power to those that would see you not exist simply isn’t an option anymore.
I used to be a pacifist. I was robbed at gunpoint in my home in the middle of the night, And I told them to take anything they wanted, but they stabbed my girlfriend anyway.
I was no longer a pacifist. She was cooperating, she was quiet, none of us were armed, but one of those wannabe thuglets still put a knife into her arm.
I was unable to continue rationalizing pacifism if it meant the people around me got hurt. I took that kids eye out with my bare hand and tore the door off my stove ragdolling his friend.
Violence doesn’t solve many problems, but it’s one of the only things that can solve violence. I don’t regret using violence to protect the people I care about.
If I was willing to bitchslap a violent bigot would that be worshipping violence and hands? I don’t have to like the idea of having to defend myself or others to be willing to do it.
Yes, worship violence and fire arms some more. That’s going to make the world a better place for sure!
Spoken like someone who doesn’t have their mere existence threatened by armed fascists on a daily basis.
Where do you live, I’m guessing US?
When you’re carrying a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
Honestly, no idea why they haven’t been controlled like here in Australia
Must be nice to never worry about defending yourself.
Self defense is an inherent right of every living thing.
‘you get further with a nice word and a gun than you do with a nice word alone’
If a fascist marches, do you ask them to please don’t do that? Do you march against them?
You get shot with a nice word and a gun
That’s the entire point of the saying. You dont get shot with a nice word and a gun because you’re not unarmed. The reference to “nice word” in the second half is like saying, “you could try to wash dishes with good thoughts, but good thoughts and scrubbing with soap and water is more effective.”
No you definitely get shot when you try to be the shooter.
Hmm…
You do know there are places where there is actual conflict happening and there is actual attempted revolution, correct? You seem to be thinking about this from a strictly “upper class western” pov where people who’ve never shot a gun in their lives carry one around because they watched YouTube videos. That’s not what’s being discussed here.
Considering the current US anti trans trend, im pretty sure this is for a western audience.
I hope anyone that touches a firearm drops dead on the spot. I don’t need adults with the mindset of a 8 year old in this world. I’m not debating anyone defending fire arms.
@ackzsel @seahorse @Jaytreeman ah yes, marginalized people who are regularly threatened by violence, armed fascists, and the state being willing to use firearms to defend themselves and their right to exist are totally the ones with the mentality of an 8-year-old, not the person who thinks we should literally just roll over and let people beat us up and murder us and eliminate us from public life in order to preserve some perfect pacifist moral high ground because firearms are an ooo spooky evil shibboleth only “bad guys” touch and “all violence is bad.” Thinking all violence, even in self-defense, is bad regardless of the context is totally a mature and well thought through position and not an overly simplistic view of how morality works. Believing that using a specific implement of violence is bad simply because a group you don’t like likes that tool is totally adult thinking. Believing in pure pacifism in the face of genocidal evil as if that’s in any way practical or moral is totally a nuanced adult view of the world and not the most simplistic 5-year-old understanding of morality that you get from children’s cartoons.
@ackzsel @seahorse @Jaytreeman seriously, when the level of your thinking is “guns bad and anyone who uses them is evil” you don’t get to accuse other people of having a child-like view of the world lol
I like what you’re saying, so I don’t mind being tagged, but I thought it was obvious I’m on your side
@Jaytreeman @seahorse @ackzsel sorry yeah you got tagged cuz you’re in the thread is all, I’m on mastodon not kbin and that’s just how it does it 😅
No worries. Keep fighting the good fight!
The other side doesn’t have to debate.
The other side has guns.
And some of them are insane enough to kill people based on skin color, gender identity / expression, and more.
With such dangerous people about, one sure is glad to have a gun.
Hope alone will get you nowhere but beneath an authoritarian’s boot, figuratively or literally. Please be pragmatic.
Question for you: would you rather all the guns be in the hands of the government? Because guns won’t disappear due to your wish. In countries all over the world, conflict is very real and not having guns would mean utter defeat for those fighting against fascists.
We get it, it would be a different world if guns were never invented. But they have been. And relinquishing that power to those that would see you not exist simply isn’t an option anymore.
I used to be a pacifist. I was robbed at gunpoint in my home in the middle of the night, And I told them to take anything they wanted, but they stabbed my girlfriend anyway.
I was no longer a pacifist. She was cooperating, she was quiet, none of us were armed, but one of those wannabe thuglets still put a knife into her arm.
I was unable to continue rationalizing pacifism if it meant the people around me got hurt. I took that kids eye out with my bare hand and tore the door off my stove ragdolling his friend.
Violence doesn’t solve many problems, but it’s one of the only things that can solve violence. I don’t regret using violence to protect the people I care about.
true i make up stories on the internet too
Being willing to defend yourself isn’t worship of violence or weapons.
Do you suggest people threatened with genocide defend themselves using …bitchslaps?
If I was willing to bitchslap a violent bigot would that be worshipping violence and hands? I don’t have to like the idea of having to defend myself or others to be willing to do it.
Unironically yes.