The Jewish-supremacist ideology motivating genocide has widespread support among Canada’s elites.

  • Canaconda@lemmy.ca
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    8 hours ago

    Now I honestly have no idea what you’re saying. Like you’re putting a lot of connected things that I vaguely agree with but like you have no general thesis for me to reply to yet you sound like you’re disagreeing with me…?

    I can’t respond to you based on what I understand cuz it’s basically you somehow think Canadians recognizing zionism bad somehow perpetuates colonialism.

    Now I don’t think you think that, but it’s really hard to boil down what you’re saying to any other perspective based on how you’re presenting it.

    • orioler25@lemmy.ca
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      6 hours ago

      I’m saying that your explanation is too reductive and ahistorical.

      Yes, the current conditions have influenced how people in the metropole – within the spaces that are privileged by colonialism like Canada, the US, the EU, the UK – question the legitimacy of this system, but that doesn’t guarantee its end. Things can just keep getting worse and more violent, and we know that because the last time people in the metropole expressed this severe level of dissatisfaction in the late-nineteenth and early-twentieth centuries, it didn’t end colonialism or capitalism. We live under the same system they did, and it has become exponentially more destructive and violent since their time. Privileged people in the metropole were satiated by marginal improvements in social welfare and economic policies like the New Deal and suburbanization, and readily abandoned any solidarity they purportedly had for each other or other workers internationally. To suggest that this system will change fundamentally just because the affluent white workers are finally unhappy with it is the exact narrative that people who have not fought this system for generations would intuitively subscribe to. Activists in the metropole tend to coop and appropriate anti-capitalist and decolonial movements more than they elevate them.

      Zionism relates to this because of how especially energizing and spectacular it has become in popular discourses in the metropole since Israel began this more militaristic campaign of genocide three years ago; over a century after their colonialism started and nearly eighty years after the first Nakba. A tactic that liberals use to obscure or minimize their own genocidal violence is to use particularly visible and obvious images of genocide and political violence to define what that violence is so that their more invisible and gradual means of genocide are less immediately apparent as genocide to most people in the metropole. Canadians will more readily understand that genocide looks like the Holocaust in Nazi Germany and Israel’s genocide of Palestinians in Gaza, and not the Canadian state’s impoverishment of Inuit in Nunavut or the targeted killings of Guatemalans by Canadian mining corporations (that the state supports financially).

      I’m saying that yes, Canadian Zionists are a hate group, but that we should not be satisfied with that recognition so long as the fundamental values and motivations of that hate remain the fundamental organizing principles of this country. My example of Hamas being officially classified as a terrorist organization under Canada’s Criminal Code, which also defines hate in a vague way that is alienated from the politics of white supremacy and settler-colonialism, was meant to demonstrate that liberals will readily concede that Zionists are hateful if it means they can still classify groups that resist colonialism as equally hateful. They care less about defending Israel than they do defending their own genocidal interests.

      • Canaconda@lemmy.ca
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        5 hours ago

        I’m saying that your explanation is too reductive and ahistorical.

        I’m saying that yes, Canadian Zionists are a hate group, but that we should not be satisfied with that recognition so long as the fundamental values and motivations of that hate remain the fundamental organizing principles of this country.

        I’m sorry but, respectfully, you are having a conversation with yourself.

        AFAIC our discussion is me saying Zionism being classified as a hate group is a good thing; and you saying it isn’t but it is and now I’m being reductive and ahistorical??