It it really, though? If you consistently disprove someone’s claims using factual information and they choose to dismiss it, then they’re just willfully ignorant.
Stupidity can be corrected. Intentional stupidity is inexcusable
Most people have a hard time accepting criticism. They interpret any perceived attack on their beliefs as an attack on them (their ego). Once their on the defensive, you have a tiny chance of convincing them. Instead, they might justify their position and/or simply attack or dismiss your argument at best. But if their not feeling nice, it’s more likely they resort to namecalling such as sheep / lib / commie / dumbass etc.
Disagree. They just believe what they believe for “non-rational” reasons. Often social or emotional reasons that they aren’t explicitly aware of. We all do this.
It doesn’t make them incapable of reason.
Fundamentally I don’t believe that a large proportion of humanity is “stupid.” I think that’s pretty narcissistic.
And this attitude often seeps into the continuously fact quoting method. Which basically makes the whole thing a non starter
Kids generally don’t have ingrained opinions or social groups formed around whether or not 2+2=4 and generally they’re really just concerned with passing tests
Now this isn’t always true and in cases where it is you WILL have trouble teaching. But the vast majority of school curriculum is not this way.
There is nothing wrong with throwing facts at people. Thats how learning happens. Somewhere along the lines, the MAGA clowns decided that they can argue that 2+2 isn’t 4 anymore.
Essentially, just because they managed to lean how to un-learn everything that requires basic logic, doesn’t mean that we need to rewrite the rules.
I’d say a school that just throws facts at the students is doing it wrong. A large part of learning is to discover connections and be able to extrapolate from principles to aquire new knowledge on their own with the tools and methods taught.
That however also disregards the very different contexts between school and some rando throwing facts at you. People go to school specifically to learn, therefore will be more open to it. Some random person throwing facts is just annoying and if you question the validity of the facts they will not get through. A common thing with people in cults is tht throwing facts at them will usually just go deeper into the cult because of the emotional aspects of it rather than cet out due to the logic.
Social beings as well. I wouldn’t even say it’s about how you present facts. We are pretty bad at interrogating our own reasoning for things. We will quote facts when asked for our reasoning, but once you start really digging in it’s often not really about that.
I actually just finished reading “How minds change” by David McRaney and would recommend it to anyone.
But if I had to summarize my biggest takeaway: you can’t really change someone’s mind, you can just facilitate convo with them that leads to them changing their own mind to some degree.
Removed by mod
This may be true, but may also just say that continuously throwing facts at someone is the wrong approach
It it really, though? If you consistently disprove someone’s claims using factual information and they choose to dismiss it, then they’re just willfully ignorant.
Stupidity can be corrected. Intentional stupidity is inexcusable
Most people have a hard time accepting criticism. They interpret any perceived attack on their beliefs as an attack on them (their ego). Once their on the defensive, you have a tiny chance of convincing them. Instead, they might justify their position and/or simply attack or dismiss your argument at best. But if their not feeling nice, it’s more likely they resort to namecalling such as sheep / lib / commie / dumbass etc.
Disagree. They just believe what they believe for “non-rational” reasons. Often social or emotional reasons that they aren’t explicitly aware of. We all do this.
It doesn’t make them incapable of reason.
Fundamentally I don’t believe that a large proportion of humanity is “stupid.” I think that’s pretty narcissistic.
And this attitude often seeps into the continuously fact quoting method. Which basically makes the whole thing a non starter
So…. Schools are dumb?
If all it does it throw facts at you, damn straight it’s dumb.
The context there is obviously very different
How so?
Kids generally don’t have ingrained opinions or social groups formed around whether or not 2+2=4 and generally they’re really just concerned with passing tests
Now this isn’t always true and in cases where it is you WILL have trouble teaching. But the vast majority of school curriculum is not this way.
There is nothing wrong with throwing facts at people. Thats how learning happens. Somewhere along the lines, the MAGA clowns decided that they can argue that 2+2 isn’t 4 anymore.
Essentially, just because they managed to lean how to un-learn everything that requires basic logic, doesn’t mean that we need to rewrite the rules.
Nothing wrong except it doesn’t work.
Learning facts doesn’t work? So again, we circle back around to a thing called “schools.”
I’d say a school that just throws facts at the students is doing it wrong. A large part of learning is to discover connections and be able to extrapolate from principles to aquire new knowledge on their own with the tools and methods taught.
That however also disregards the very different contexts between school and some rando throwing facts at you. People go to school specifically to learn, therefore will be more open to it. Some random person throwing facts is just annoying and if you question the validity of the facts they will not get through. A common thing with people in cults is tht throwing facts at them will usually just go deeper into the cult because of the emotional aspects of it rather than cet out due to the logic.
You’re being down voted for facts lol. We’re emotional, often irrational beings. How/when we present facts matters
Social beings as well. I wouldn’t even say it’s about how you present facts. We are pretty bad at interrogating our own reasoning for things. We will quote facts when asked for our reasoning, but once you start really digging in it’s often not really about that.
I actually just finished reading “How minds change” by David McRaney and would recommend it to anyone.
But if I had to summarize my biggest takeaway: you can’t really change someone’s mind, you can just facilitate convo with them that leads to them changing their own mind to some degree.
Better than throwing bullets at someone?