Framework is definitely not Linux only (laptops are Windows by default , but they offer a no-os option to install your own). They are however generally supportive of Linux, and it’s possible that they helped make the fingerprint reader firmware work well with Linux, though I have no specific information that this was the case.
FWIW, most ThinkPad fingerprint readers (except a couple of models maybe) work out-of-the-box on Linux. Like the one on my Z13 for instance, I didn’t have to do anything to get it going on Fedora.
Also, take a look at the libfprint compatibility list here, there’s nearly 200 compatible readers listed, so I wouldn’t exactly say the number of readers that work on Linux are “rare”.
That’s incorrect - check the hardware IDs, they’re different. If it’s the same model they’ll have the same hardware ID.
Your linked thread is also from three years ago - that’s a long time in the Linux world where things change quickly. I could just as easily dig up a thread about x not working on pretty much any topic, so it’s not really evidence of anything.
Edit: I just checked the Gitlab releases page for libfprint. Not only have they added more devices (that aren’t listed on the page that I linked previously), it also proves that support for many new devices have been added over the last three years. So claiming that nothing has changed in these past three years, is being disingenuous towards the good efforts made by these devs.
Same model, different device id. It happens. There are tons more of device IDs out there that don’t work on Linux than those ones that do.
I’m not going to waste money and time proving it but this is a deeply seeded flaw of the Linux community. “Oh these things don’t work” is always met with “oh it does you just have to take some impossible steps like decoding this list of USB IDs into actual products you can buy. No, you can’t just use any random fingerprint reader which totally works on Windows. It Has to be the exact id on the list. Could be marketed as the same model but you have to make sure you have the right id before you buy it somehow. Good luck!” No business is going to deal with that and only hobbyists into modifying their computer is going to use the OS. Everyone else wants to use their computer to do things, not have their computer as a project in itself.
@MJBrune@d3Xt3r Overall I understand your opinion and based on your needs Windows is probably the best solution.
I do however, disagree with the statement about the Linux community. Firstly, if a device doesnt work “out of the box”, the manufacturer is able to provide a driver for their device, or submit the driver directly to the kernal via a merge request so that the “out of the box” scenario does work.
When that hasn’t happened the community WILL help you, this help is NOT a “flaw”!
No the flaw is in the narrative that it works just as well as windows. I’ve used Linux as a desktop for almost a decade before giving it to Windows. It has never been as easy to use as windows and likely won’t get there. There are a huge number of reasons why but the biggest one is that the community doesn’t point out flaws in the operating system. When people do it’s met with that it works well enough if you jump through hoops and walk backwards and pray. It’s not working well enough for lots of people and it’s time to acknowledge that so we can fix it. Not push away the problems.
No, that’s a marketing issue. Different device id == different model, technically speaking. Hardware makers won’t just alter a device ID for no reason at all.
There are tons more of device IDs out there that don’t work on Linux than those ones that do.
Perhaps, but [citation needed].
No, you can’t just use any random fingerprint reader which totally works on Windows.
First of all, no one is going out and buying random fingerprint readers - these are usually bundled as part of their laptop/desktop - in which case, it’s the buyer’s responsibility to verify Linux compatibility with that computer as a whole. You can’t expect to pop Linux into any random computer, or connect any random peripheral and just expect everything to work automagically. I mean, it does happen, but that’s generally with known good Linux hardware. Eg System76s, Frameworks, ThinkPads etc.
Also, even on Windows, a fingerprint reader doesn’t normally work out of the box - you’ll need to install the drivers for it to get it going (unless of course you’re using a Windows build provided out-of-the-box by the system manufacturer). Either way, it’s manufacturer’s responsibility to create and upload drivers, and it’s their responsibility to create a Linux driver. Otherwise it’s up to the community to create it, in which case you’re back to usual rule-of-thumb where you buy only popular hardware models with known good Linux support.
Ha, I mean if you think there are only 200 different device IDs for fingerprint readers, go ahead and believe that.
it’s the buyer’s responsibility to verify Linux compatibility with that computer as a whole.
That’s the exact problem.
You can’t expect to pop Linux into any random computer, or connect any random peripheral and just expect everything to work automagically.
Exactly, hobby project problems. I enjoy a good Linux computer hobby project but I also leave hobby projects in the hobby project section my life. When I want to get work done, I use the thing that lets me get work done.
Also, even on Windows, a fingerprint reader doesn’t normally work out of the box - you’ll need to install the drivers for it to get it going (unless of course you’re using a Windows build provided out-of-the-box by the system manufacturer)
(Most do, you can submit your driver to Microsoft to be included in the system update system.)
Either way, it’s manufacturer’s responsibility to create and upload drivers, and it’s their responsibility to create a Linux driver. Otherwise it’s up to the community to create it, in which case you’re back to usual rule-of-thumb where you buy only popular hardware models with known good Linux support.
Right, as hobbyists building drivers for their hobbyist’s projects.
For most readers from what I found. Framework is Linux only and readers do exist that work on Linux but they are more rare.
Framework is definitely not Linux only (laptops are Windows by default , but they offer a no-os option to install your own). They are however generally supportive of Linux, and it’s possible that they helped make the fingerprint reader firmware work well with Linux, though I have no specific information that this was the case.
My mistake, they seem very much geared toward Linux folk.
FWIW, most ThinkPad fingerprint readers (except a couple of models maybe) work out-of-the-box on Linux. Like the one on my Z13 for instance, I didn’t have to do anything to get it going on Fedora.
Also, take a look at the libfprint compatibility list here, there’s nearly 200 compatible readers listed, so I wouldn’t exactly say the number of readers that work on Linux are “rare”.
That’s not truly 200. A quick look at the list shows the same model over and over again. https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/gc8a2e/i_finally_found_a_cheap_usb_fingerprint_reader/ here are a ton of people complaining about them 3 years ago. The climate likely hasn’t changed in the Linux world about fingerprint readers.
That’s incorrect - check the hardware IDs, they’re different. If it’s the same model they’ll have the same hardware ID.
Your linked thread is also from three years ago - that’s a long time in the Linux world where things change quickly. I could just as easily dig up a thread about x not working on pretty much any topic, so it’s not really evidence of anything.
Edit: I just checked the Gitlab releases page for libfprint. Not only have they added more devices (that aren’t listed on the page that I linked previously), it also proves that support for many new devices have been added over the last three years. So claiming that nothing has changed in these past three years, is being disingenuous towards the good efforts made by these devs.
Same model, different device id. It happens. There are tons more of device IDs out there that don’t work on Linux than those ones that do.
I’m not going to waste money and time proving it but this is a deeply seeded flaw of the Linux community. “Oh these things don’t work” is always met with “oh it does you just have to take some impossible steps like decoding this list of USB IDs into actual products you can buy. No, you can’t just use any random fingerprint reader which totally works on Windows. It Has to be the exact id on the list. Could be marketed as the same model but you have to make sure you have the right id before you buy it somehow. Good luck!” No business is going to deal with that and only hobbyists into modifying their computer is going to use the OS. Everyone else wants to use their computer to do things, not have their computer as a project in itself.
@MJBrune @d3Xt3r Overall I understand your opinion and based on your needs Windows is probably the best solution.
I do however, disagree with the statement about the Linux community. Firstly, if a device doesnt work “out of the box”, the manufacturer is able to provide a driver for their device, or submit the driver directly to the kernal via a merge request so that the “out of the box” scenario does work.
When that hasn’t happened the community WILL help you, this help is NOT a “flaw”!
No the flaw is in the narrative that it works just as well as windows. I’ve used Linux as a desktop for almost a decade before giving it to Windows. It has never been as easy to use as windows and likely won’t get there. There are a huge number of reasons why but the biggest one is that the community doesn’t point out flaws in the operating system. When people do it’s met with that it works well enough if you jump through hoops and walk backwards and pray. It’s not working well enough for lots of people and it’s time to acknowledge that so we can fix it. Not push away the problems.
No, that’s a marketing issue. Different device id == different model, technically speaking. Hardware makers won’t just alter a device ID for no reason at all.
Perhaps, but [citation needed].
First of all, no one is going out and buying random fingerprint readers - these are usually bundled as part of their laptop/desktop - in which case, it’s the buyer’s responsibility to verify Linux compatibility with that computer as a whole. You can’t expect to pop Linux into any random computer, or connect any random peripheral and just expect everything to work automagically. I mean, it does happen, but that’s generally with known good Linux hardware. Eg System76s, Frameworks, ThinkPads etc.
Also, even on Windows, a fingerprint reader doesn’t normally work out of the box - you’ll need to install the drivers for it to get it going (unless of course you’re using a Windows build provided out-of-the-box by the system manufacturer). Either way, it’s manufacturer’s responsibility to create and upload drivers, and it’s their responsibility to create a Linux driver. Otherwise it’s up to the community to create it, in which case you’re back to usual rule-of-thumb where you buy only popular hardware models with known good Linux support.
Ha, I mean if you think there are only 200 different device IDs for fingerprint readers, go ahead and believe that.
That’s the exact problem.
Exactly, hobby project problems. I enjoy a good Linux computer hobby project but I also leave hobby projects in the hobby project section my life. When I want to get work done, I use the thing that lets me get work done.
(Most do, you can submit your driver to Microsoft to be included in the system update system.)
Right, as hobbyists building drivers for their hobbyist’s projects.
The one on my E15 doesn’t work :(