And Hollywood’s gay character is ALWAYS the same: “gay” voice, fashionable, sassy, uptight, obsessive, but no real emotions or depth. It’s like someone once told them what gay men are like based on a 90s stereotype and they just stuck with it.
Honestly I’m really tired of it. OK cool, some story lines benefit from having gay characters, or their universe is broad enough that yeah you’re going to run into them at some point… But Hollywood seems to have decided that EVERY show must have a gay character, no matter how forcefully or awkwardly you had to add them to the cast. Great, you’ve openly embraced the LGBTQ community, we get it. And yes there are a lot more of us than most people realize, but the larger percentage are NOT out, not immediately accepted by all of their friends and coworkers, and most certainly not safe to show their true nature in general public. I mean it’s cool that Hollywood wants to show an ideal world where those things are possible, but it seems to me that if they really wanted to make an impact then they should be showing what really happens, how people are getting hurt physically and emotionally, how children are being disowned by their families… Show the real-life drama that is driving people to suicide and give us shows that actually make people think about their actions towards the community. I know, it’s really too much to hope for because -GASP- it might hurt their ratings.
This is so interesting to me because for the longest time, the only queer stories ever told in Hollywood were the tragedies - happy queer characters are relatively new, and I think space for both is so important. Hollywood can absolutely be doing more in showing some of the current issues our communities are actually facing, but there’s huge benefit in showing possibility models - especially for young people and their parents. So many parents are terrified of what their kid’s life is going to be like, because how they think of queer people has been influenced by decades of tragiqueer storytelling - those positive stories can help a lot.
Hmm I guess I hadn’t thought about it as role models. It’s certainly a good thing to show that LGBTQ’s are regular people too, and acceptance is a beautiful thing, I just feel like they’re over-doing it and they are just going to drive away the people who actually need to hear this message. I hear complaints about “woke being shoved in everyone’s face” and this is the sort of thing that comes to mind. Fortunately I’m starting to see some shows like the new Quantum Leap where gender-nonconformity isn’t the central theme but rather the character just are who they are, nobody makes a big deal out of it, and there might be some episodes that deal directly with their trauma. I feel like this is a better way to send a message without immediately scaring away those who are reacting negatively against people being themselves – basically a Conservative tactic where you sneak things in a little at a time so people don’t notice.
Regardless, I really hope we’re reached a turning point where the next generation won’t be so damn focused on gender roles being black&white. Hopefully we find a balance somewhere that lets everyone just start getting along with each other.
Oh absolutely- I feel like the best representation we have is characters who just happen to be part of the rainbow community, rather than it being a focus of the plot. Queer-specific stories are important and useful, but it’s so important for everyone - us, allies, young people, general public - to see rainbow characters just living their lives in tv and movies without it being a huge part of their character or storyline.
People are generally pretty lazy, uncreative and easily influenced - you show more of the exaggerated ideal on screen because society lacks imagination. They can handle little to no nuance.
So while I understand your frustration, there is also the reality that if you show that all people get disowned by their family, then you normalize/perpetuate that behavior even further (especially in less experientially diverse areas). It becomes and remains “one of the steps” of the process of coming out our meeting outed.
Basically, if someone comes out on a generic, middle of the road CBS TV show like the big bang theory or something… and the out character is building up fear about a pending negative interaction with the parent character, and the parent ends up saying, “we knew all along… And we just love you as long as your safe and happy” - well then that interaction actually imprints something on real life grandma in Missouri. She sits with that for a bit and processes, discusses a bit with friends at the salon maybe, and when her granddaughter, who she loves, tells her that she likes girls one day, grandma (who is caught off guard and doesn’t have much imagination) reaches and finds that big bang theory moment as an example of what a “good grandma would do” and she repeats a version of it.
So again, I understand your frustration, but the above is (a portion) of the motivation to show those influencing “examples” in media.
Yeah that does make a lot of sense. And while I was reading your reply another thought came to mind. I do actually process the shows I watch, but I bet a lot of people just ‘absorb’ what happened and move on without really thinking about it. However it’s still in the back of their mind, and it still provides a fresh path for the brain to take when an unknown situation comes up.
And Hollywood’s gay character is ALWAYS the same: “gay” voice, fashionable, sassy, uptight, obsessive, but no real emotions or depth. It’s like someone once told them what gay men are like based on a 90s stereotype and they just stuck with it.
And lesbians are always ugly and butch
Honestly I’m really tired of it. OK cool, some story lines benefit from having gay characters, or their universe is broad enough that yeah you’re going to run into them at some point… But Hollywood seems to have decided that EVERY show must have a gay character, no matter how forcefully or awkwardly you had to add them to the cast. Great, you’ve openly embraced the LGBTQ community, we get it. And yes there are a lot more of us than most people realize, but the larger percentage are NOT out, not immediately accepted by all of their friends and coworkers, and most certainly not safe to show their true nature in general public. I mean it’s cool that Hollywood wants to show an ideal world where those things are possible, but it seems to me that if they really wanted to make an impact then they should be showing what really happens, how people are getting hurt physically and emotionally, how children are being disowned by their families… Show the real-life drama that is driving people to suicide and give us shows that actually make people think about their actions towards the community. I know, it’s really too much to hope for because -GASP- it might hurt their ratings.
This is so interesting to me because for the longest time, the only queer stories ever told in Hollywood were the tragedies - happy queer characters are relatively new, and I think space for both is so important. Hollywood can absolutely be doing more in showing some of the current issues our communities are actually facing, but there’s huge benefit in showing possibility models - especially for young people and their parents. So many parents are terrified of what their kid’s life is going to be like, because how they think of queer people has been influenced by decades of tragiqueer storytelling - those positive stories can help a lot.
Hmm I guess I hadn’t thought about it as role models. It’s certainly a good thing to show that LGBTQ’s are regular people too, and acceptance is a beautiful thing, I just feel like they’re over-doing it and they are just going to drive away the people who actually need to hear this message. I hear complaints about “woke being shoved in everyone’s face” and this is the sort of thing that comes to mind. Fortunately I’m starting to see some shows like the new Quantum Leap where gender-nonconformity isn’t the central theme but rather the character just are who they are, nobody makes a big deal out of it, and there might be some episodes that deal directly with their trauma. I feel like this is a better way to send a message without immediately scaring away those who are reacting negatively against people being themselves – basically a Conservative tactic where you sneak things in a little at a time so people don’t notice.
Regardless, I really hope we’re reached a turning point where the next generation won’t be so damn focused on gender roles being black&white. Hopefully we find a balance somewhere that lets everyone just start getting along with each other.
Oh absolutely- I feel like the best representation we have is characters who just happen to be part of the rainbow community, rather than it being a focus of the plot. Queer-specific stories are important and useful, but it’s so important for everyone - us, allies, young people, general public - to see rainbow characters just living their lives in tv and movies without it being a huge part of their character or storyline.
Ask them what “woke” actually means.
People are generally pretty lazy, uncreative and easily influenced - you show more of the exaggerated ideal on screen because society lacks imagination. They can handle little to no nuance.
So while I understand your frustration, there is also the reality that if you show that all people get disowned by their family, then you normalize/perpetuate that behavior even further (especially in less experientially diverse areas). It becomes and remains “one of the steps” of the process of coming out our meeting outed.
Basically, if someone comes out on a generic, middle of the road CBS TV show like the big bang theory or something… and the out character is building up fear about a pending negative interaction with the parent character, and the parent ends up saying, “we knew all along… And we just love you as long as your safe and happy” - well then that interaction actually imprints something on real life grandma in Missouri. She sits with that for a bit and processes, discusses a bit with friends at the salon maybe, and when her granddaughter, who she loves, tells her that she likes girls one day, grandma (who is caught off guard and doesn’t have much imagination) reaches and finds that big bang theory moment as an example of what a “good grandma would do” and she repeats a version of it.
So again, I understand your frustration, but the above is (a portion) of the motivation to show those influencing “examples” in media.
Yeah that does make a lot of sense. And while I was reading your reply another thought came to mind. I do actually process the shows I watch, but I bet a lot of people just ‘absorb’ what happened and move on without really thinking about it. However it’s still in the back of their mind, and it still provides a fresh path for the brain to take when an unknown situation comes up.
“A Man Called Otto” handled it pretty well I think
I always think of Brooklyn 99 to counteract those stereotypical characters.