I should have stayed home with my cats and ordered take-out. The gays are just as transphobic as anyone else. Fuck people. I opened myself up and I’m mad I did.
I’m so sorry this happened to you!
Allow this gay to say: you are 100% a real woman, full stop.
And anyone who thinks otherwise is a transphobic asshole, not a queer ally or interested in queer liberation, and you are better off without them in your life.
I second this gay!
I’m a cis lesbian and I’ll punch anyone who’s transphobic right in the face.
I also think it’s rather sad that we’re generalising in an LGBTQ+ space, of all places. Please remember that they want us to be divided because we’re stronger when we stick together.
We should be allowed to vent here in an LGBTQ+ space without being tone-policed. I’m sorry (believe me, I’m sorry) that transphobia is a problem in the cis queer community.
That’s what you should say to the transphobe.
“Not all straight…” “Not all men…” “Not all cis…”
When does this become an issue with generalization and stop being an issue of covering up/defending shitty, toxic behavior within a community?
I’ve come to assume that legit everyone, regardless of their political or community affiliation (YES, INCLUDING TRANS PEOPLE/SPACES), is transphobic until proven otherwise. I trust no one these days. But I’m really sorry you experienced this ignorance & harm in a space that SHOULD be accepting… It gets so fucking tiring. You’re a beautiful woman and NO ONE can take that truth from you.
That’s kinda why I say we’re the most discriminated group of people in the world. There’s nowhere to be safe, not even in our own communities
The more marginalized your intersectional community, the more discrimination you face from that community.
For example, jf you think it’s tough being a woman in the united states, try being a black woman. And if you think that’s hard, try being a black trans woman.
At some point, you just lose community entirely, as that becomes a privilege for those less marginalized.
You’re a real woman and anyone who questions it is loosing touch with their humanity.
You may not have had the default feminine childhood that AFAB people like myself had, but I have seen trans women work so much harder and bust their asses just to be called “Ma’am” so in my eyes? You’re absolutely a real woman. You just played the game on hard mode while the rest of us were on easy and normal mode.
You’re as real a woman as any of us.
You worked for it rather than inheriting it.
Fuck that guy. You do you, and don’t let dumb shits like them bring you down.
ETA: fuck them* I had assumed by gay op meant guy. Sorry.
Well, fuck her. I was happy I made a new friend. I was very wrong. Full disclosure: I disagreed with her regarding celebrities and assault allegations. I learned (well I guess I already knew) when I disagree with a cis woman about something - I’m “not a real woman anyways”. My identity hinges on being a good little pet for the cis. Fuck that.
(For the record, my first instinct is to believe the alleged victims of sex assualt. I know it takes a lot of courage to come forward. It’s just that when large sums of money are involved, I prefer to let the courts decide. How monstrous, and manly, of me).
Ah ok sorry for the confusion. Edited my comment.
And yeah she can fuck off.
No need to be sorry at all. I think it’s important for people to know that actually, a lot of the transphobia women like me face comes not from violent men, but rather other women. At least that’s been my experience.
Yeah I’ve noticed that as well. I had a very frustrating argument with an old lady about bathroom usages a few weeks ago and it still makes me furious thinking about the stupid shit that she kept on saying.
comes not from violent men, but rather other women
Just in case you travel abroad… beware that it might be a cultural thing. In some countries, where men owning women is normalized, “letting a fox into the henhouse” may be reason for directly killing the “fox”. In more civilized countries, it’s the “hens” starting a ruckus when they see “their spaces” getting “invaded”, while men might seem more tolerant only because of “a hole is a hole” mentality.
Tolerance and respect are hard, with a humanity coming from a history of systematic abuse of everyone, by everyone.
She probably knew what would hurt most and used that. Doesn’t help much at the moment, but maybe it takes the tip off. It’s shit you lost a potential friend, but at least you lost a hurtful person at the same time.
“Not a real woman” as if trans women are not also the victims of assault by horrible men…
And as if somehow it’s a requirement to dismiss other women’s stories of assault to qualify for feminity.
Ohhh I already wanted to give this person a big slap but now I wish I could give them a big double slap! In Minecraft
Why in Minecraft??
It’s a bit of a joke, to give (very flimsy) plausible deniablity after saying something that could be seen as encouraging violence. Like someone might say that cops should be shot, in minecraft. know your meme has a good article about it.
That sucks to have such an invalidating end to what should be an inclusive day, and it’ll sorry yoy experienced that. Tbh it kind of sounds like the trash took herself out of your life if she’s not able to respo d to a difference of opinion with respect and grace. May you find much better friends than her.
If I were drunk and angry, that position might earn you being called a “pick me,” ngl, but that’s because you’re a woman. Such an opinion is no reason to question your gender identity, because there is no opinion so bad it changes who you are or justifies harming you in that way. Period. You’re a woman, and no dickhead gets to take that from you just because they’re mad.
I’m wondering if the person who called OP not a real woman was coming from a similar place to drunk and angry you.
Most charitably, she probably thinks it’s okay to call what she thinks are “pick me” women “not real women,” because according to her you can never arrive at that opinion unless your worldview is unduly influenced by trying to please men, unless you are actively trying to come off as “on the men’s side” so that some man sees you say that and rates you a little higher in his “dateable or not” scale. No real woman with non-man-pleasing motivations would ever disagree with her on that topic unless the woman was actively trying to get picked by a man. Dismiss all disagreement by namecalling them as “not a real woman.”
Or she probably thinks that having (what she sees as) an extremely harmful opinion justifies hurting the other because hurting them teaches them not to have bad opinions… somehow… Having a “pick me” opinion means your entire gender is fake because non-trans women would never ever once have the Bad Opinion, and trans women are “fake” women who don’t have the Real Lifetime Gender Experience to arrive at the One True Good Opinion.
That ain’t it. We don’t misgender awful cis people, so why are we doing it to trans people? The answer is “to hurt,” but it also has the extra effect of “if you step out of line your identity is no longer valid, trans acceptance is entirely conditional on always having the perfect opinion, otherwise we’ll whip you back into shape with some prime invalidation.” Of making onlooking trans people doubt whether they’re really accepted, whether they pulled out the invalidation to be hurtful and they still are for trans rights, or if they pulled it out because they genuinely think you can’t be trans but are willing to pretend for the nice people and go mask-off when sufficiently angered.
Her exact words after “well, you’re not a real woman” were “well it’s true? right? you’re not a real woman”. The meaning was clear.
So, either clearly transphobic or clearly willing to act as such when a gun is not pressed to her head. Either way, not acceptable.
The context gives me terf vibes so I’m going to say the woman may have been thinking something like “If you were a ‘real woman’ you’d have dealt with sexual assault yourself as a victim and would have more empathy.” Which ignores how often trans women are victims and just like, falls apart when you look at things like the scores of cis women still supporting Chris Brown. Men don’t have a monopoly on unfeminist opinions.
It also tells women privileged enough to not have a sexual assault story, like myself, that we must have experienced THIS much suffering to be allowed gender. No woman can ever be free of this, there’s no hope or good in the world whatsoever, every single woman has an assault story (and the ones who don’t simply don’t count as women anymore!). Imagine being in a post-oppression world, except not really because you are denied a gender on account of not suffering enough. About the 2838281st time TERFs try to invalidate trans women and inadvertently whack cis women like myself. If your exclusionary belief always ends up excluding the people you consider “real women” try expanding your definition out to include trans women too 😒
Ah, a nuanced opinion. That’s just too much for some people to process. I’m sorry you went through that. Bad enough that they couldn’t accept the difference of opinion, but finding the most painful way to claw at your soul stinks of cruelty to me, perhaps you’re lucky they showed their true colours on day one.
Fair enough on showing true colours sooner rather than later, but last day of Pride and the big bash still feels like cruel timing. I almost never go out to Pride, especially not alone. Should have trusted my usual instinct on that one.
I am so so so sorry that happened to you. That is so incredibly fucked up and not okay. The fact this happened at Pride is just…so heartbreaking. I am a cis-het male, but I inevitably cry tears of joy every year at our local Pride festival because there are so many people from across the entire LGBTQ2IAS+ community in our very conservative/religious city who get so much shit from judgmental bigots, every day of the year, but Pride is a time when they are not just accepted, but fucking CELEBRATED! Friend, if the hater who spewed those lies to you won’t celebrate you, I sure as hell will. Such_lettuce7970, I dont know you IRL, but judging from your post history you use Linux, and youre here on the threadiverse, and you have seem to have a heart for sharing vulnerability with others which is such an incredible gift for all of us to be blessed by. You’re a fucking cool-ass woman, and I hope you are able to find people IRL who are able to validate that about yourself. Sending a handful of soldarity tears and many, many loving vibes your way (and if you’re cool with it, some WiFi hugs as well). Youre a fucking treasure, and your cats are lucky as shit to be able to hang out with you.
Is okay. Aside from my cool-ass cats I’ve got a cool-ass wife too. She’s my joy. She fills my heart.
It’s just, well I feel like it would be more fair to her for me to have more platonic friends too. I try. I tried.
I’m glad you have a wife that is supportive.
I hear you about platonic friends. Its really hard to make friends as an adult. I’m in the same boat. My wife has friends because she’s lived in this town for decades, but I’m an immigrant who’s only been here since 2019 and 80% of the other people in our town drive pickup trucks and think vaccines kill people. The struggle is real. Whatever its worth I’m proud of you for putting yourself out there. I dont have the courage to try that so much myself.
Are you in Canada too? I’m in Ontario.
Yeah I’m in BC
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Middle aged white bi guy here, I just cut off several family members within the last week for being transphobic. Fuck the person that said that to you and fuck transphobes. They are a cancer and they’re everywhere, unfortunately. You deserve better and I hope you find people that support you for who you are.
As a GNC person myself, the worst bigotry I have experienced personally has come from cis gay people. What was said to you was not acceptable. Your identity is not contingent upon the side that you take in an argument. This woman knowingly chose violence, and that stain is on her. It means little, but this internet stranger sees you. We have to care for one another, especially when we disagree.
Wonder if it’s a case of people being discriminated against, so instead of standing in solidarity with their fellow victims they’re looking for a taste of power, of being on the other side.
It does seem depressingly common for formerly disadvantaged people to abandon empathy once they gain a modicum of power. See: the divide and conquer strategy that has been effectively wielded against the working class for all of history.
I wonder if this is just a human trait. “Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely” is a quote for a reason.
I certainly see elements of that in the neurodiverse spaces as well.
This is why I have a nasty cycle of
- enter neurodivergent space
- see ”NT bad”
- leave neurodivergent space
Yall, just like we’re not a monolith, NTs aren’t either!? I don’t like identity-based generalizations. I also understand the need for minorities to vent, and sometimes it involves harsh language and generalizations they don’t actually believe. And sometimes it’s hard for me to see the line between “this is a vent and I, and the community at large, don’t actually believe that all NTs are inferior people, I just had a frustrating experience with many and want to vent without being tone policed” and “it’s just venting, back off tone policer, nevermind that I actually do truly believe that the filthy NTs are inferior.”
However, either one will drive me, a minority who the space is intended for, out. Wonder if there will ever be a spot for minorities that is both modded to be free of bigotry, but also doesn’t allow the venting.
EDIT: not criticizing the Beehaw neurodivergence community, haven’t looked there yet
I tend to speak up when I see it and my admonishments are usually upvoted. So there is that. But yes it’s exhausting.
oh gosh the reddit ADHD community was so bad with this i had to unsubscribe just to get away from the toxicity
It’s amazing how many people will pay themselves on the back for being a good person, and then just spout nasty rubbish like that in the next breath.
I’d be happy to be your friend.
:( sorry that happened, what a shitty person
Bland as fuck CIS white guy here. They deserve as many throat punches (though maybe just a death stare is safer) as possible.
Also cats are better than most people.
I’m so sorry that we as a people seem to be hell bent on both halting progress and undoing what little we’ve had in the modern era. You deserve better.
It is always frustrating trying to determine if these people actually believe what they’re saying, or if they’re grasping for anything they can say to be hurtful. Do they actually believe you are a woman in their heart, and just contradict their own beliefs in the name of hurting the bad person with the bad opinion? Or do they think you are all faking but decide to humor the pleasant people about their gender and mask-off around anyone they dislike? Either way, it creates an environment of “do you really accept my identity as valid, or is it conditional upon whether you like me?” Not the kind of thing that should be happening at all, let alone at Pride.
I’m sorry this happened to you. Some people are just not nice people. You certainly are a woman and you deserve better.
