New research on Monday contradicted the commonly held idea that males dominate females among primates, revealing far more nuanced power dynamics in the relationships of our close relatives.

New research on Monday contradicted the commonly held idea that males dominate females among primates, revealing far more nuanced power dynamics in the relationships of our close relatives.

    • TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.todayEnglish
      8·
      6 days ago

      You mean the guy selling me my leaded bone broth made an inaccurate observation about the dynamics of social hierarchies? These scientists are making claims that the accumulated lead in my brain is disputing.

  • Dasus@lemmy.worldEnglish
    16·
    5 days ago

    “New study says”

    The author of the original “alpha” article spend fucking decades trying to tell people he was sorely mistaken and hadn’t been observing group dynamics but family dynamics.

    • solo@piefed.socialEnglish
      12·
      5 days ago

      Just to clarify, not family dynamics, but wolves in captivity.

      Edit: What we call “wolf packs” are just families. They are loving and take care of each other. In the unnatural environment of captivity, wolfs demonstrate different and aggressive behaviors, and studying these behaviors lead to the alpha-male myth

      • Dasus@lemmy.worldEnglish
        3·
        5 days ago

        Okay that is a good point to note. Social dynamics of a family, in captivity.

        Could very well compare it to how a single family acts around the dinner table (in a certain room, specific setting, all “bound” to the table or at least the house) — in comparison to say, a large family gathering. You’d have such different social dynamics, and you would sneak off with your cousins to do shenanigans while your dads aren’t watching. Whereas at a family dinner kid would just be gloomy and play with his phone to which his dad would say something negative about phones during dinner.

        I don’t know I may have taken the metaphor too far.

  • Not_mikey@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
    12·
    5 days ago

    The title is misleading, the study doesn’t say they’re a myth, just not the norm. This would be like saying, “Marine mammals are a myth.”

    The study isn’t saying “alpha males don’t exist”. It’s saying not all primates have clear dominance across gender lines, ie. Males always dominating females. Some species like chimps and baboons do have male dominated social structures, while others have female dominated social structures like bonobos and lemur. Though for the majority, 70%, there is no clear gender that is dominant.

    It doesn’t say anything about hierarchy within gender though. As far as I know chimps do have a hierarchy within the males and there is an “alpha” at the top. That’s not a myth and since the article does say chimps are male dominated it can be said that the troops has an alpha male who is at the top of the hierarchy.

    This doesn’t mean humans naturally have alpha males, as the article shows there is a lot of variance within primates, but alpha males are a real part of that variety, not a myth.

    • solo@piefed.socialEnglish
      5·
      5 days ago

      I tend to agree with what you say but I feel like mentionning a couple of things I see perhaps differently.

      I believe saying marine mammals are a myth has nothing to do with claiming alpha males don’t exist. The first is about a biological classification, the latter is about observed (or projected) social behaviors within one species.

      Apart from that, and to my understanding, the manosphere has taken a hold of the alpha male narrative and expanded it far beyond the scientifically debunked myth. I do not imply that the fact that the alpha male myth has been debunked means that there are no hierarchical structures in species, just that when they are present, they are misrepresented in order to promote competitive narratives. This is why primatologist Frans de Waal inadvertently popularized the term ‘alpha male.’ Now, he’s debunking common stereotypes to explain what an ‘alpha male’ really is – empathetic and protective.