• then_three_more@lemmy.worldEnglish
        109·
        8 months ago

        I entered into an agreement with a car manufacturer to be able to sell their cars in the UK. After I had people place orders (and pay) for a bunch of them the manufacturer decided that they were no longer supplying cars to the UK. Forcing me to issue my customers with refunds.

      • gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        56·
        8 months ago

        Fraud exists because you were driving the car for a while with your normal drivers license and everything was perfectly fine, but now (for example) Elon says you have to get a specialized additional Tesla certification license from Tesla, but only offers it to countries whose names start with vowels because he was on a ketamine bender one night.

        It’s a retroactive, unilateral change to a contract, which is generally considered legally questionable at the very least. And - you guessed it - possibly fraud.

        • Link@rentadrunk.orgEnglish
          4·
          8 months ago

          Correct me if I’m wrong but the game isn’t out yet on PC so no one has been playing (driving) the game.

            • Link@rentadrunk.orgEnglish
              6·
              8 months ago

              There is a big difference between cancelling an order and taking away a product that you have been using.

              I don’t agree with Sony’s actions as everyone should be able to buy the game but this is Sony cancelling an order as the game isn’t even out yet on PC.

              • gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
                22·
                8 months ago

                It’s now a pattern and practice, though. HD2 could have been a fluke. But this now indicates that they’re probably going to do something similar with all of their current-gen games. THAT is the point people are becoming furious with.

                • Link@rentadrunk.orgEnglish
                  3·
                  8 months ago

                  That was obvious though. There was articles last week saying that Ghost of Tsushima wouldn’t remove the PSN requirement. It is also listed above the buy button (although that could be recent).

                  It was pretty clear from their response to HD2 that they would try again. Sure they shouldn’t have been selling preorders in countries that don’t have PSN access but it isn’t really surprising that they are enforcing it here.

        • ocassionallyaduck@lemmy.worldEnglish
          6·
          8 months ago

          You should look up what the word “fraud” means in a legal context.

          You would have an incredibly, overwhelmingly difficult tike attempting to prove that in court at this moment.

          Fraud requires intentional deception and requires you to have lost something. This is a proactive action to prevent misunderstanding and from you purchasing something that won’t work, and refunds your purchase. The loss, and the intent, are both missing.

          This is categorically not fraud.

          • Dieterlan@lemmy.worldEnglish
            23·
            8 months ago

            It sounds to me like you are talking about what Steam is doing, with the geolocking and refunds (not fraud), while the other person is talking about what Sony is doing, with adding PSN requirements after the fact (maybe fraud?).

      • hoshikarakitaridia@lemmy.worldEnglish
        12·
        8 months ago

        More like I pay you for water in my house and midway in you decided to add berry flavor.

        Great, now my spaghetti taste like berry, and I didn’t agree to that.

    • Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
      2·
      7 months ago

      Please not. I don’t want Sony to retreat entirely from the pc market (and they most likely will do it if they are not on Steam anymore).

  • FluffyPotato@lemm.eeEnglish
    104·
    8 months ago

    So what Sony is saying is that I should just pirate the game since there is no legal way to buy it?

  • tal@lemmy.todayEnglish
    27·
    8 months ago

    Hmm.

    I haven’t been following this, but if I understand, all this flows from Sony’s decision to (a) disallow developers targeting their platform from selling the game in regions that PSN isn’t available, even on other platforms, like Steam, and (b) not to offer PSN service in the Baltics. I’m not actually sure that it’s legal for Sony to do this.

    I don’t think that that’d be fraud – as some people are talking about – but I do know that the EU has had some digital single market legislation that doesn’t let you buy something in part of the EU if you can’t use it in another part. I think that their interest is that they don’t want to have companies creating barriers to movement of labor around the EU, where someone can’t move from EU member A to B because it makes all their digital products unusable. If you cannot play a game in the Baltics, I’m not sure that it’s legal to sell it, under EU law, in France or the like.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Single_Market

    It might also be legal – not sure. Probably depends on how it’s structured, what exactly Sony is doing, and the specifics of the European Digital Single Market restrictions. And I’m not familiar with the fine points of any of those.

    • Ballistic_86@lemmy.worldEnglish
      4·
      8 months ago

      It would be an interesting issue to resolve if the EU were to pursue it. I guess one could argue that PS5s are sold in the EU, even with the PSN restriction in certain regions. I’d guess a resolution to this would have Sony remove all of their content on Steam, which I consider a negative for gaming in-general.

      I’m guessing there is, or will be, a carve out for this type of thing. Precedent could be argued with my PS5 example above.

      • hitmyspot@aussie.zoneEnglish
        7·
        8 months ago

        The idea is to encourage the opposite. If they want access to furnace, Germany, Italy, they need to make it available in smaller countries. It becomes financially viable to cater to small countries when not doing so loses the big countries.

        • tb_@lemmy.worldEnglish
          3·
          8 months ago

          Evidently it was not clear enough.

          Or Valve didn’t check every last little detail and expected the publisher to take care of it, until it became a big controversy.

          – assuming it is, in fact, Valve who is behind this change and not Sony themselves.

            • tb_@lemmy.worldEnglish
              4·
              8 months ago

              That would require Valve to be the reason behind this change, and reading every description for every game is something I doubt they do.

              Clearly this is the responsibility of the publisher.

  • Bruhh@lemmy.worldEnglish
    2·
    8 months ago

    I thought you only needed a PSN account for the multiplayer portion of the game?