A fancy ceremony doesn’t change how people feel about the other person, nor the level of obligations they actually have (emotionally, financially it can get complicated). If you’re unhappy and they reason cannot be changed (like chronic illness requiring significant care) then you fucking leave if that’s what you want. Staying only creates two miserable people instead of one, and your partner will definitely understand even if it hurts.
A fancy ceremony doesn’t change how people feel about the other person, nor the level of obligations they actually have
You literally take an oath at the ceremony vowing to uphold an extremely high level of obligations to another person.
If you’re making vows at a wedding ceremony that you feel you can just nope out on if shit hits the fan, why are you getting married? What is the point?
I agree. The wedding shouldn’t change how you feel about the other person because you should already be 100% dedicated if you’re thinking of getting married.
I made a vow to my wife when we got married to care for her in sickness and in health. I do not care what happens in life, I would never abandon her. Period. That is the burden of the vow I made. In my mind my personal integrity is foundationally attached to it.
If you’re comfortable with abandoning a spouse over health issues, the marriage was a sham from the get go. Like, what are you doing at the ceremony? Making vows with your fingers crossed behind your back? 🤞🤞🤞
A lot of people in the current culture we live in do not place any value on their word or honor. I don’t really blame people for this since the system we live in almost exclusively rewards exactly the opposite behavior.
But it does make it very hard to communicate with people when you don’t have the same vocabulary.
It seems like you and I believe a vow is something that you make and would hold yourself to regardless of circumstance. But the nature of our capitalistic society teaches us from very young age that if it will improve your standing, your finances, or your situation in some way, then it is okay to break your personal code.
With that rambling paragraph in mind, it’s not surprising when we find out that most folks don’t have a personal code and vows mean nothing more than a pinky swear.
I didn’t say anything about a divorce or murder. Maybe I was bad at getting my point across.
The point I’m attempting to make is that putting value on your word, and by association giving extra value to a vow over another type of promise, is a lesser respected or necessary part of being a human in the late stage capitalist society that we live in.
This can be evidenced by people saying that a vow can easily be broken if the circumstances change.
That’s correct. People have always been people. In my short time on this dirty ball in space I have noticed that people I know, and people I work with, and people I interact with on the street, all put less and less value on intangible things like honor, respect, and your personal word being worth something as time goes on.
I’m in no way saying people were better in the past. I’m saying that the value assigned to these intangibles is currently worth less than it was in recent cultural memory.
Possibly that is part of it. But I am not sitting here saying humanity is getting worse over time in general. Just that the value placed on some of the unwritten parts of the contract have lessened in value somewhat.
If you’re making vows at a wedding ceremony that you feel you can just nope out on if shit hits the fan, why are you getting married? What is the point?
I agree. The wedding shouldn’t change how you feel about the other person because you should already be 100% dedicated if you’re thinking of getting married
And get married at 23, plan life of kids and whatever. Car accident a year later and she/he is a quadruped. What you’re describing isnt love, or devetion, it’s indentured servitude. If you truly love the other person you’d want them to leave.
But it’s why I never plan on being married who the fucks knows what will happen tomorrow, let alone a decade down the road.
Im 59, my parter (f 56) and I have had that discussion, she insists she’ll stay and take care of me if it happened and I said that will make me even more miserable and more depressed and I’d want her to leave.
I can’t even wrap my head around how selfish and self absorned you’d have to be to insists someone take care of you for decades of you were bedridden or even house bound etc
You’re not understanding what I’m saying…whether or not you want to leave your partner when things go wrong is entirely independent of marriage. You don’t stay because you got married and now it’s just too bad, you stay because you love them. Marriage should be exactly zero percent of why you choose to stay. Staying with your partner, not because you want to but because you feel obligated, is just demeaning to them and cruel.
A fancy ceremony doesn’t change how people feel about the other person, nor the level of obligations they actually have (emotionally, financially it can get complicated). If you’re unhappy and they reason cannot be changed (like chronic illness requiring significant care) then you fucking leave if that’s what you want. Staying only creates two miserable people instead of one, and your partner will definitely understand even if it hurts.
You literally take an oath at the ceremony vowing to uphold an extremely high level of obligations to another person.
If you’re making vows at a wedding ceremony that you feel you can just nope out on if shit hits the fan, why are you getting married? What is the point?
I agree. The wedding shouldn’t change how you feel about the other person because you should already be 100% dedicated if you’re thinking of getting married.
I made a vow to my wife when we got married to care for her in sickness and in health. I do not care what happens in life, I would never abandon her. Period. That is the burden of the vow I made. In my mind my personal integrity is foundationally attached to it.
If you’re comfortable with abandoning a spouse over health issues, the marriage was a sham from the get go. Like, what are you doing at the ceremony? Making vows with your fingers crossed behind your back? 🤞🤞🤞
A lot of people in the current culture we live in do not place any value on their word or honor. I don’t really blame people for this since the system we live in almost exclusively rewards exactly the opposite behavior.
But it does make it very hard to communicate with people when you don’t have the same vocabulary.
It seems like you and I believe a vow is something that you make and would hold yourself to regardless of circumstance. But the nature of our capitalistic society teaches us from very young age that if it will improve your standing, your finances, or your situation in some way, then it is okay to break your personal code.
With that rambling paragraph in mind, it’s not surprising when we find out that most folks don’t have a personal code and vows mean nothing more than a pinky swear.
Plenty of people before 2025 divorced for any number of reasons.
Plenty of people straight up murdered their spouse because divorce wasn’t an option.
Saying “people in the current culture we live in do not place any value on their word or honor” means you have no idea how people in the past lived.
People are today as they have always been, just with different gadgets and environment.
I didn’t say anything about a divorce or murder. Maybe I was bad at getting my point across.
The point I’m attempting to make is that putting value on your word, and by association giving extra value to a vow over another type of promise, is a lesser respected or necessary part of being a human in the late stage capitalist society that we live in.
This can be evidenced by people saying that a vow can easily be broken if the circumstances change.
That is not what a vow means.
My point is that it hasn’t changed. People have always been people.
That’s correct. People have always been people. In my short time on this dirty ball in space I have noticed that people I know, and people I work with, and people I interact with on the street, all put less and less value on intangible things like honor, respect, and your personal word being worth something as time goes on.
I’m in no way saying people were better in the past. I’m saying that the value assigned to these intangibles is currently worth less than it was in recent cultural memory.
I think what you’re describing is the breakdown of the social contract
Possibly that is part of it. But I am not sitting here saying humanity is getting worse over time in general. Just that the value placed on some of the unwritten parts of the contract have lessened in value somewhat.
We’re 100% on the same page.
And get married at 23, plan life of kids and whatever. Car accident a year later and she/he is a quadruped. What you’re describing isnt love, or devetion, it’s indentured servitude. If you truly love the other person you’d want them to leave.
But it’s why I never plan on being married who the fucks knows what will happen tomorrow, let alone a decade down the road.
Im 59, my parter (f 56) and I have had that discussion, she insists she’ll stay and take care of me if it happened and I said that will make me even more miserable and more depressed and I’d want her to leave.
I can’t even wrap my head around how selfish and self absorned you’d have to be to insists someone take care of you for decades of you were bedridden or even house bound etc
If you’re not ready to do that, then just don’t get married. It’s very simple. There’s no law saying you need to marry someone.
You’re not understanding what I’m saying…whether or not you want to leave your partner when things go wrong is entirely independent of marriage. You don’t stay because you got married and now it’s just too bad, you stay because you love them. Marriage should be exactly zero percent of why you choose to stay. Staying with your partner, not because you want to but because you feel obligated, is just demeaning to them and cruel.