I guess for this post I’m just coming here to talk a little bit about my health problems and maybe do a little ego preservation by shifting some blame off of me and my poor decisions.
Anyway, I’m 24 and for the past 6 months or so I’ve been visiting a few different doctors trying to figure out these cardiovascular issues that I’ve been having.
I remember last November being suddenly woke up by a sudden intense squeezing my chest, like someone was gripping my heart and manually beating it. It scared the hell out of me and I went to the ER at 3am. I get there, I’m fine, I tell them that I stopped feeling that sensation but I was so scared by it I wanted a doctor to tell me I wasn’t dying. I wasn’t… Good. They give me some meds to calm down my heart if it does it again, and then some beta blockers to help me sleep.
Fast forward a few months and I’ve gotten a test from the cardiologist and it looks like I’m all good. My heart is fine I just need to sleep more and worry less. The issue is that my symptoms haven’t really improved all that much and in terms of affects on my extremeties I’m seeing greater and greater amounts of vascular visibility, discoloration of my finger nails and I’m still having infrequent chest discomfort.
I mention this multiple times to them. Yet still they tell me that I’m young and the test didn’t reveal anything so I’m just worrying too much. I visit again a few weeks later and it’s the same shit.
Anyway, I’m not a doctor although maybe I should have tried to visit a different specialist sooner. It wasn’t until about two weeks ago when I see a massive varicose vein pop out of my calf and I realize oh I should probably talk to a vein specialist.
I go, my leg veins are dilated, it’s still early stages so it’s not that bad. I’ve lost a lot of weight over the past year or so (about 20kg), quit cigarettes, and overall my lifestyle trends towards much healthier. More of the same and managing the condition should be relatively doable.
Yet now I’m here lying in bed frustrated. Not only at the doctors but the messaging we have around health as though it’s a foregone conclusion that you’ll have it when you’re young and then managing it is something of concern for your later years.
I know this foolishness and error of my thinking, and I know the immense privilege of mine to have come to take on that viewpoint, but man does it piss me off everytime I think back about any health issues, covid, or other things when people just shrug about the potential impacts because oh your young and your body is strong.
It makes me so regretful and spiteful because now I have a health condition which I shouldn’t have developed had I made better health decisions in the past. I wish people would encourage better stewardship to your own body before it becomes a problem.
Anyway, if you have any encouragement to offer me I’d really appreciate it. I’m having trouble sleeping and this post was a way for me to vent some of those emotions. I’m far from home which I’m grateful for because at least I’m not paying for this in the US, but that also means I’m far from a lot of my support.
Thanks and I know this account is new but I’ve really appreciated this forum over the years.
As a physician I would definitely recommend to go see a doctor if you sense that something is wrong. You never know if its just a passing thing or an alarming symptom needing urgent care unless maybe you have a medical degree but even then its still recommended since you aren’t a specialist in everything.
You should also realize that those doctors are also humans and probably burned out from overwork so don’t be so hard on them
Yeah, that’s my focus. It’s frustrating but I’d never vent anything on them. Medical field is tough work usually unless you’re one of those elective cosmetic surgery types. Even then that’s probably only the case if you’re the owner of that practice.
Either way my parents instilled in me a fear of God and that God is public confrontation. I’ll complain on here but in my presentation to anyone in person I’ll certainly be polite.
I mentioned elsewhere that due to the lifestyle changes it does finally feel like I’m on the up and up. Got some meds that work well and such. Feeling pretty normal again despite the vein thing. Thanks for the validation
I’ve had a debilitating chronic illness since early childhood, and primary care physicians can be really weird about it. “Well, other than that, you’re healthy!” Sure, and other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?
When I was college-aged I went to the ER with a particularly nasty episode and the triage nurse insisted that I must just be hungover.
Several years ago a close friend was comatose in the ICU and nurses kept saying “Wow, he’s the youngest person on the ward!” as if they were impressed.
I mention this multiple times to them. Yet still they tell me that I’m young and the test didn’t reveal anything so I’m just worrying too much. I visit again a few weeks later and it’s the same shit.
Ugh, people give young folk shit for “thinking they’re immortal” and it turns out their doctors seem to think that, too, only out of jealousy or something.
Good luck, comrade.
I know. I even joked that “hey, I’m American I don’t come to the hospital unless I think I’m dying”
Thanks for sharing your experience. It helped me feel better to know I’m not going it alone.
This is exactly what happened to me. GPs refused to do any tests for nearly 4 years, saying I was too young for it to be anything serious. Eventually my employer paid for me to get tests at a private hospital. Turned out to be thyroid cancer.
I unfortunately had a good friend pass away this past year because of cardiac issues as well. He was 29. I’m sure this happening weighs heavily on my mind throughout the process and even now.
I know I’m probably fine but why not just say that your heart is fine according to the tests. Why dip into irrelevant information for the symptoms at hand?
If you wake up at night with your heart pounding you might consider getting tested for sleep apnea. Sleep apnea can cause cardiac strain during sleep and resolves when you wake up and breathe unobstructed, but long term the stress on the heart can lead to atrial fibrillation and eventually CHF. Another sign of sleep apnea is waking up frequently in the night to pee, seems unrelated, but it causes disregulation of antidiuretic hormone
Exactly how apnea works for me. Also waking up with a headache, numbness in the extremities, pounding heart, waking abruptly, and other shit. One symptom once in a while doesn’t mean apnea but if this happens commonly, yeah, get that checked out.
Thanks, fortunately my sleep issued have been resolved as my heart became regular after that period.
Of all my issues I don’t have that one at least.
The thing with the transient heart issues is that there might not be any way to find out why it happened unless you are hooked up to a monitor at the moment when it happens.
So if you know what triggers it then you can try to induce it while hooked up. Or if it happens often enough you could ask them to put you on portable monitor that you wear for a day or a few days. And maybe you will catch it.
You said that you got a medication for attacks of chest tightness. Have you used it and did it help?
Is dialated veins a diagnosis you were given? Am I correct in guessing you had some basic text like blood work, bp, and an ECG done? And maybe something else to look at the vein on your leg?
There might just not be a reason to worry or much to be done. What would make you feel better taken care of?
Yeah I’ve been getting tests done over the past few months. I found it frustrating because the cardiologist didn’t offer any tips about who to talk to if in having these other symptoms (vascular issues) if it wasn’t related to the heart.
They just assumed I’m in my own head.
“There might just not be a reason to worry or much to be done.”
No offense but this is the same thing I was pushing back against. Rapid deterioration of blood flow in the extremities is an issue because it’s falls into the criteria of serious or actively getting worse. I understand it’s not their speciality but I mean, they are a heart doctor and should be able to point me to someone who can help.
Anyway, yeah my heart situation has improved dramatically. I’m off the meds; they were just a thing to take as needed. I think it’s all downhill from here so I’m feeling positive.
Well the cardiologist didn’t give you any tips about who to talk to, because they didn’t do a full assessment of your other problem. A given symptom could have any number of causes and before sending to a specialist, it is required to go through a certain amount of due diligence. You don’t just get sent to a specialist because your problem happens to involve a certain body system.
For example “my skin is turning yellow!” might sound like a problem for dermatologist, but jaundice (yellow skin) is usually caused by a liver problem. There are all sorts of liver problems, some of which have special specialists. And a liver problem could be secondary to another problem somewhere else. For example a number of disorders of red blood cells can screw up your liver. So maybe you need a hematologist. And of course there are various Hepatitises that might need help from Infectious Disease. Or it could be a side effect of a medication, drug or other chemical exposure… You see? It isn’t responsible for someone to just make willy-nilly suggestions which will send you up the garden path, waste your time that could be spent on something useful, and itself erode trust in the system because you were sent running around on a wild goose chase to doctors who took one look at you and said “why the hell are you here? I can’t help you.”
You primary/family/main doctor/NP is the person to bring those concerns to, and they are the one who should do the initial assessment and if they can’t deal with it themselves, send you to someone who can.
And actually, without going into detail, I have seen a few problems caused when doctors stepped “out of their lane” and tried to give some advice where they should have not. There can be substantial confusion; that’s the most polite way I can put it. You don’t want to be the victim of one of those.
They just assumed I’m in my own head.
Did the cardiologist say that to you?
Rapid deterioration of blood flow in the extremities is an issue because it’s falls into the criteria of serious or actively getting worse
Do you have a specific diagnosis in mind you think is being missed? Or an idea of what kind of health problem you have? Because it sounds to me like you had a few episodes of chest pain without an established cause, and then later you found a varicose vein. These are both perfectly common normal things even for younger people. You have seen what sounds like several different medical providers involved and nobody can find anything alarming.
(Once I went to Emergency services because I thought I was having a heart attack but I was just having heart burn. Boy, they don’t call it that for nothing! It really hurt. I felt I was rudely treated in that situation because the doctor thought I was “wasting” his precious time on my bullshit not-a-problem. They didn’t have to act in that way to me. But at the end of the day, it’s better that I was not having a heart attack.)
What do you think should be done about your varicose veins? These are very common, many people get them. For most people, their biggest complaint is cosmetic. There is not any good surgical/pharmacological treatments as far as I am aware. Try not to stand up or sit in a chair for long stretches of time. You can elevate your feet to above the level of the heart sometimes. Compression stockings if you like. Moisturize your skin. Keep not smoking and getting more exercise.
Here are a couple of pages about varicose veins. Shorter Varicose veins - NHS ; Longer Varicose veins and spider veins
So again the question is: What would make you feel better taken care of?
You got a real talent for making someone worried about their health feel good. Expert talent. I hope you get payed for being a jackass.
Yeah they did say that actually. So your sarcastic remark about that is precisely what they said. Also can you read the text? Have you had heartburn? Does it feel like your heart not beating correctly? It doesn’t. Don’t presume idiocy on my part to same extent that you assume I might not know what I’m talking about. The specialist should suggest going to a GP if that’s the obvious go to wisdom.
Goddamn, doctors and you (if you are one or just carry water for this bullshit It doesn’t matter) act like the bureaucracy of a hospital is easy to navigate or understand. Please go ahead! Diagnose me! Ask me to diagnose myself again! I said in the post I’ve erred in my approach but lemme say it again “I’m not a goddamn doctor”. I didn’t ask to see a specialist, that’s who I was referred to after discussing the symptoms with the GP at that particular hospital. Did he do a test? No. Should he have? Probably I don’t know.
If someone shows up and the tests you ran show things are fine, maybe you as an experienced medical professional should tell that to your patient. “Go get some general tests it doesn’t look like it’s related to heart” All I did was say something was still messed up and told it’s in my head.
Take a goddamn step off your pedestal and try to understand how people act when they’re unsure and don’t know what to do. All I did in this post was malign the way people assume things about young people not having issues. Don’t presume I’m an asshole just because you like to be one.
Have you had heartburn? Does it feel like your heart not beating correctly? It doesn’t.
It was a long time ago but I definitely felt like my heart was stopped working properly. I felt like I was going to die. That’s why I went to the emergency. I was trying to share a quite similar story by way of empathy but for some reason you take it as hostile.
Don’t presume idiocy on my part to same extent that you assume I might not know what I’m talking about.
Well I have tried asking you a number of questions to clarify but instead of answering, you also get mad and say things like “Ask me to diagnose myself again!”. So you don’t like it when people try to establish where a mutual understanding might exist. You don’t like it when someone tries to explain the logic being used on the other side. You don’t like it when questions regarding your own goals are asked.
The specialist should suggest going to a GP if that’s the obvious go to wisdom.
Honestly, most people can figure out that if a specialist said they are fine, that at some point in the future, they will need to return to medical care for some reason. And that the cardiologist wouldn’t be the appropriate person in your case.
act like the bureaucracy of a hospital is easy to navigate or understand
No I am explaining it to you in a a general way (because it is different from place to place) so you might understand what the barriers you are facing. But you are not interested in that, you would prefer to feel victimized by everybody.
maybe you as an experienced medical professional should tell that to your patient. “Go get some general tests it doesn’t look like it’s related to heart”
No they shouldn’t. What’s a “general test”? There is no such thing as “a general test” which is why nobody has advised you to do that. And a test that is meant to investigate a symptom wouldn’t be “general” anymore anyway, it would be “specific”.
And again it would be very wrong for a cardiologist to just think of some random other tests and tell you to tell another doctor to run them. That would be dangerous. They are only supposed to discuss their own areas of expertise.
If the specialist says you are fine, you go back to the GP and decide together if it warrants more investigation. Sometimes they can go up a ladder of trying one thing or another.
Don’t presume I’m an asshole
Did I say that? And the cardiologist, did they say you were in your head? I think you are mind reading. I do that sometimes too. Like you, I suck at it. Need to break the habit.
If someone is explaining something to you, it doesn’t mean they think you are stupid, it just means they think you might benefit from knowing something. Most people do not know exactly what is your pre existing knowledge so they might tell you things you already know by mistake. You find this offensive and patronizing. OTOH, you are annoyed by questions which are meant to find out abut what you know. You seem to be extremely unfamiliar with the basic process of the medical system. So people who have tried to help you have not explained basic things like roles and systems. (Or they tried to but there was some barrier to it.) This has led for you to have expectations that were not realistic. And probably expectations which were not very clear since I have asked twice already what could have happened to make you feel properly taken care of and it seems to just upset you.
Well since everyone who tried to help you is a jackass, eventually you might start to figure out what the common denominator is there. I think if you ask at the beginning of visits, or if you get sent for a test or to another doctor, “What should I expect?” then listen to the answer, and in addition to any clarifications you have, follow with “and what happens after that?” then you would probably be less confused about the whole thing.
“I was trying to share a quite similar story by way of empathy, but for some reason you take it as hostile”
Assuming you are earnest here, this is why your story came off that way to me. Your framing in your comment appears as though your usage of the pronoun “I” is one where you take on the mantle of the one you’re speaking to, in this case me. Look to your prelude to the story; It is not framed in a way that suggests this is your experience. “You have seen what sounds like several different medical providers involved and nobody can find anything alarming” followed by your aside. This suggests that the following aside is a rhetorical “taking on the mantle of” the other speaker. Perhaps, I shouldn’t assume that, but I think given what I listed here you should take note with your framing as I work to improve on my seeming error.
Furthermore, given our earlier interaction I don’t think you understand the influence from the previous discussion well. I’m sharing a personal story and interaction about my subjective experience and you asked for evidence to prove that I’m justified in that feeling. Did you do this? Did you do that? appeared to me as bad faith sea-lioning given the framing. It wasn’t presented in a way which affirmed my experience and provided helpful tips like you’re now saying was your intention. The essence of my post was that “man, I wish I took better care of myself and that people don’t use age as a framing metric for why something isn’t an issue.” Being told that “your organ is healthy and reveals no issues stemming from it” is sufficient and more effective messaging as it doesn’t appeal to something that may be irrelevant.
“Honestly most people can (italicized) figure out that if a specialist…” I listened to their instructions took the medicine topically as instructed, and saw no reduction in symptoms. This isn’t me returning for some reason, it’s explicitly because the doctor I was referred to suggested this adjustments which didn’t appear to have the impact desired. I don’t find it unreasonable to go back to talk to the doctor that prescribed you the medicine and lifestyle changes to discuss the insufficiency. This is condescending language by the way, but I imagine that since our discussion went sour I won’t hold it against you. That’s silly and fruitless given my own hostile language. If the cardiologist believes I should go back the GP at this point, then he should suggest that by providing that in the suggestions for further investigation.
Given the above two paragraphs, I think it should be clear what my expectation is for optimal care.
“What is a general test…” My reference to general tests is an error on my part in terms of expressing myself it seems. I meant general health screening tests performed by a GP in relation to my symptoms.
“very wrong for a cardiologist…” Yes, I agree. Which is why I would say it would be prudent for them to suggest another appointment with the GP. Which I did go do eventually, but it took me a while due to being told that I was “worrying too much” and potentially causing said issues.
“If someone is explaining…” I think my first paragraph responds to this one. Wish you started with “I think if you ask at the beginning of visits…” because it’s the essence of what you’re trying to say without the issues that our previous interaction encountered. Also, no not everyone who tried to help me, just you who I seemed to erroneously think was being one.
I find your writing very difficult to understand. And your reaction to clarifying questions is to get upset and to assume some bad motive just because your mind is not legible to me? I told you: I am a shit mind reader. You are too. Your mind reading above is bizarre.
clearly you do not want my input because of something I said before. So I will block you to avoid bothering you in the future.
I explained to you why asking clarifying questions in this way was invalidating and you just cover your ears. Fine block me it doesn’t really matter but I think I was quite patient and even handed in my final response. Call it mind reading if you want, but this is just what social cues are and a reasonable interpretation of the implications of your writing. Mind reading is a really nice excuse to use when communication breakdown occurs because it shifts the honus completely off the self and onto the other. When a poor job is done expressing oneself, it is the error of the speaker and the listener. People have bad intentions online and you didn’t express yourself as overtly friendly. This final little jab and the “now I’m going to block you” is what I’m talking about. It’s like you think because you’re being overly respectable and as such your words can’t possibly have a bad effect.
Sorry you’re dealing with all that. Happy to hear that you’ve got healthcare tho. Heart problems and extremity discoloration does sound an awful lot like some long Covid type shit. Might be something down that treatment avenue worth looking at. Good luck and hang in there!
I literally cried after my ER visit when I broke my arm because it cost me around 25 USD. Everytime I run into or talk to someone back home I immediately talk up Luigi Mangione as a hero and malign the suffering that we go through at home just to visit a doctor.
Thanks for the encouragement, Mr. ByeThen.
Welcome, Jack!
