Every american I’ve met has been willing to kill for something, or willing to die for something.

But not a single one of them is willing to be inconvenienced in the slightest. That’s our sickness.

So i spent a long time ruminating on that and now i’m even more depressed than I was and shit is getting bad again. Sorry for the livejournal post, I haven’t made one in a while. Still around.

  • KnilAdlez [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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    15 days ago

    I was in a midwest convenience store a while ago. I asked the person at the register how her day was and she said, " oh, you know…" I hear a greeting happening behind me and someone responds to a similar question with “Livin the dream…”.

    That experience will haunt me for the rest of my life. People are not doing ok. At this point dying for a purpose, any purpose, is the best they can imagine. But adding any amount of suffering to their lived experience is intolerable.


    • Le_Wokisme [they/them, undecided]@hexbear.net
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      15 days ago

      I asked the person at the register how her day was

      visible-disgust

      as someone who has worked a counter and as a neurodivergent person please kill the impulse to do this with strangers and people who cannot give an honest answer

      • GalaxyBrain [they/them]@hexbear.net
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        15 days ago

        People arent going to forego basic pleasantries as a society. If we are going to fight alienation and build communities with the workers around us… we gotta talk to strangers.

        • Le_Wokisme [they/them, undecided]@hexbear.net
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          15 days ago

          somebody who doesn’t care about me asking how i’m doing doesn’t fight alienation

          me lying to them as expected doesn’t fight alienation

          committing the social faux pas of telling the truth doesn’t fight alienation, and it might get me fired.

          • GalaxyBrain [they/them]@hexbear.net
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            15 days ago

            Someone who does care asking fights alienation. Enough people behind the counter have picked up on the fact that i do and then later I catch some on their smoke break where they can speak more freely and things go from there. I know the people at my local stores as at least casual friends, we dont visit each other but we chit chat and have a rapport. I generally break the ice by complaining about my bullshit job I just got off to kinda indicate we’re on the same team. I’ve made quite a few friends over the counter and have gotten into a position where my setting them up with union organizers to get the ball rolling has gotten the goods. If someone is posting here, you can trust them with the truth and they are the people who should be asking. Building a rapport with the workers in your neighborhood is cool and good. To do so, you gotta express interest in their day. Despite the general rule about not being honest when asked that, it is a viable option. It comes in phrasing you can say ‘its been a rough one today’ and they’ll say ‘sorry to hear that. Hope the rest of the day goes better.’. They dont want details but its acceptable to say its been a bit of a crap day. Most other people work and understand having a bad day at work, its relatable af. And frankly, part of the job of cashier is human interaction and customers who want to avoid it are all about self checkout, which really helps corporations cut jobs. I wont apologize for or ‘kill the part of myself’ that wants to interact with the people around me. If that makes you uncomfortable then that is on you to deal with. You are making an incredibly unreasonable and unrealistic ask of the entirety of society to suit your comforts and there is a wide gap between that and society being ableist, sorry to say. A public facing job is going to involve idle chit chat. Under communism I would imagine you wouldnt have to do that kind of job and someone who is better socially could handle it. You cant just tell people not to interact with other people when those interactions make you uncomfortable, im sorry you’re in a position that they cant be avoided and that is a social issue. But people being friendly or polite isnt a social issue. Its just something thst makes you uncomfortable

            • Le_Wokisme [they/them, undecided]@hexbear.net
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              14 days ago

              you are not sufficiently critical of social norms. this is an ableism and accommodation thing.

              the proscribed interaction i described is bullshit and there’s no room for what you want to do when it’s crowded out by the empty routine.

              and maybe hit the enter key once in a while

              • GalaxyBrain [they/them]@hexbear.net
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                14 days ago

                No it isnt. If that is the level of accommodation you require then it’s something you need to deal with. How would you suggest strangers interact? Purely transactionally or otherwise we dont speak to one another? Aside from access to jobs that require less social interaction, which i think seems a lot more reasonable than everyone changing their behavior seems a lot more practical, im really not sure what action yku would like to see.

                • Le_Wokisme [they/them, undecided]@hexbear.net
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                  14 days ago

                  How would you suggest strangers interact?

                  by not fucking asking questions they don’t care about the answer to. it’s all well and good if you are genuine but you’re doing that in a sea of disingenuous custom and that problem needs to go away.

                  • SevenSkalls [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                    14 days ago

                    I would disagree. People generally do want to know how others are feeling and these conversations often start with some sort of proscribed ritual but can then turn into either conversations or repeated short interactions can possibly build up a rapport. At the very least, it doesn’t hurt to be polite.

                    We must at least acknowledge each other as human. Walking through the world in our own little bubbles considering every other service worker in our life as nothing but a facilitator of our goods and services is awful and contributing to the alienation we’re in today.

                  • GalaxyBrain [they/them]@hexbear.net
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                    14 days ago

                    How do you know they don’t care about the answer? I bet quite a few do. You gotta adjust the level of detail to how well you know someone, they arent looking for a whole conversation, you both have shit to do. People are generally nicer than you’re giving credit for i think. I have this rosy image cause I talk to a lot of strangers and most are delighted to have a quick chat

                  • So I used to have an issue like this about the expression “bless you” when people sneeze. I’m solidly in the atheist camp, and the entire history of the phrase is nonsense anyway.

                    But I finally realized it doesn’t matter. People started saying it because of the plague, but it’s still courteous to say something when someone sneezes. It doesn’t matter if you say, “bless you” “salud” “gesundheit” etc, just that you say something.

                    It’s polite, that’s it. I’m not forsaking my beliefs and converting to Christianity by saying “bless you” whether it bothers me slightly or not.

                • AF_R [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                  14 days ago

                  How would you suggest strangers interact? Purely transactionally or otherwise we dont speak to one another?

                  That’s literally how it works in many non-American cultures, yes. Seems extremely weird how pushy you’re being about this.

                  seems a lot more reasonable than everyone changing their behavior

                  Literally what you’re trying to do, kind of invalidates your entire argument

                  setting them up with union organizers to get the ball rolling has gotten the goods

                  That’s great, happy for you and them.

                  How many others have you gotten fired for trying?

                  • Dirt_Possum [she/her, undecided]@hexbear.net
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                    13 days ago

                    That’s literally how it works in many non-American cultures, yes.

                    I may not be a world-weary traveler, but I have spent time in different cultures and they have been more cordial and more interactive with each other across the store counter than the “serve me now robot” mentality of USians. The only times I have seen the “don’t exchange greetings” mindset in other cultures are when it’s explicitly across the class divide, where the bourgsies wouldn’t deign to speak with the lowly proles serving them.

                    Literally what you’re trying to do

                    No, it’s literally what Le_Wokisme and apparently you are trying to do. The default social behavior is to recognize that the person serving you is human and the common way to do that is to greet them in some way, usually by asking them about the state of their being (which is by the way common across many non-western non-global north cultures). There is room for behaving differently depending on particular circumstances. If someone behind the counter is clearly having a bad day and their body language is clear they don’t want to talk, then maybe an understanding sad-smile and a nod will suffice. But insisting that we’re better off or that it’s more respectful to not to say anything in recognition of the human interaction you’re having is absurd. I say this as an introvert with social phobias who had/has to work retail and service. It’s still a thousand times more degrading to be treated as if I were a vending machine or as if I’m not even there than it is to be greeted in passing even when I don’t feel like making small talk.

                    That’s great, happy for you and them.

                    Amazing what kind of positive things can come out of basic human social interactions.

                    How many others have you gotten fired for trying?

                    Am I actually reading this on hexbear? Someone is making the argument that it’s wrong to attempt to let people know what their options are for unionizing because of the potential their bosses might find out and retaliate? I guess that’s it, we better throw in the towel, any attempt at unionizing is a wash, now that the capitalist class might do some shit to punish it. Also, @GalaxyBrain@hexbear.net made it clear they were talking about being on the service employee side of the counter - they are talking about telling their customers about their union organizers and being successful, not handing out strike fliers to a worker while they’re working ffs.


                    My advice to anyone still reading this thread is to do what you think is right for that particular circumstance with that particular service person. Obviously I can’t speak for all neurodivergent people who work retail because at least one in this thread doesn’t want to be greeted. But speaking for myself and the coworkers and friends I’ve known who have expressed their sentiments with me, many if not most of us appreciate being greeted and asked how we’re doing, not ignored.

                  • That’s great, happy for you and them. How many others have you gotten fired for trying?

                    centrist

                    In what universe is conceding the class war ever going to help us? The bourgeois might fight back so we shouldn’t do anything?

                    Thomas Sankara:

                    As revolutionaries, we don’t have the right to say we are tired of explaining. We must never stop explaining. We know that when the people understand, they cannot help but follow us.

                  • GalaxyBrain [they/them]@hexbear.net
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                    14 days ago

                    None, because i’m smart. Only really get into radical stuff when you spot people on break, who i have already established a rapport with by asking about their day and continuing the conversation as we do the checkout thing.

                    For the rest, other people have already represented my case pretty well and I dont feel like entertaining this any further.

                  • AssortedBiscuits [they/them]@hexbear.net
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                    13 days ago

                    That’s literally how it works in many non-American cultures, yes. Seems extremely weird how pushy you’re being about this.

                    Virtually nobody outside of weird ass Krauts and Nordics act like this. If anything, your average person is far chattier to strangers than your average Burgerlander. In most countries, you can get away discussing (and arguing) politics with random strangers while you can’t even discuss politics with acquaintances in the US. Taxi uncs are a thing throughout the world. They’re anything but quiet.

                    But then again, that’s the price Western European societies and their settler-colonial spawns pay for being the geographical origin of capitalism. It turns their society into a crowd of completely atomized individuals that can’t even communicate with each other who start malding whether someone gives them a simple greeting, a social custom that has existed in every single human society throughout history and honestly even in every single nonhuman society.

      • Lurkmore [none/use name, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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        14 days ago

        Hard disagree. There is nothing wrong with being kind to strangers and especially the people forced to serve you.

        I’ve worked retail for way too long, and it’s worse being treated like an inanimate object. I have to greet the customers and I hate not to be acknowledged at all.

        People acting like my existence isn’t an inconvenience is nice. People acknowledging that I’m real, and tangible, and human, is nice. I ask people how they are, I smile at them, I tell them to have a good day. I apologize too much, and constantly say excuse me.

        I’m not trying to force myself on anyone. I feel compelled to be nice and it bothers me when I’m not. I also strongly prefer when people are nice to me. I don’t think trying to further shed our humanity and alianate each other will ever help us.

    • Lurkmore [none/use name, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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      14 days ago

      I switched to “oh you know” and “another day” a while back and I’ve noticed a lot of other people have similar statements now too. Usually a response of “yeah…” or sarcasm.

      I don’t think people are doing okay, and I don’t think very many people have any hope for the future.

    • LENINSGHOSTFACEKILLA [he/him]@hexbear.netOP
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      15 days ago

      sorry, I’ve been off hexbear a while and I don’t think we’ve interacted so when I saw the sonic picture i was trying to crack the code as to how they’re related, until I saw another post of yours and realized its a signature. Are we bringing back signatures of the old gamefaqs days or is it because now everybody works from home and its expected?