• 0laura@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      3 months ago

      the non libs should do whatever they do AND vote though. there’s no harm in voting for the lesser evil if you don’t use it as an excuse to not also do other things.

      • m532 [she/her]@hexbear.net
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        3 months ago

        There is harm in voting it legitimizes the system. We want the evil empire to die, why should we bow to its customs?

      • Tomorrow_Farewell [any, they/them]@hexbear.net
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        3 months ago

        there’s no harm in voting for the lesser evil

        The USian Dem party is not a lesser evil. It’s the same as the other part of your uniparty, except that it pretends to be different from its twin.

        Hell, Trump seems to be more senile and less capable of running your genocide machine than Harris. I don’t see you call everyone to vote for him for the sake of burying the settler-colonial project earlier and reducing harm this way.

        • 0laura@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          3 months ago

          voting third party in the USA is kinda like not voting at all from what I’ve heard. the system is kinda fucked up like that. it’s a bit better over here in germany, there isn’t really a “third party”, just lots of parties of varying sizes. but yea ideally you would vote for a better party and that would actually lead to change. tho I doubt that voting for a third party does more good than voting for the lesser of the two big evils.

          • hypercracker@hexbear.net
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            3 months ago

            is literally german

            Ah okay. Your people just really love genocide so you can’t comprehend why someone wouldn’t want to vote for genocide.

          • SoyViking [he/him]@hexbear.net
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            3 months ago

            voting third party in the USA is kinda like not voting at all

            Not exactly. Even within the mind prison of liberal electoralism, voting for a third party in a FPTP system is different from not voting at all.

            If the “lesser evil” becomes afraid that they are going to lose because of people voting for non-evil third parties, they will have an incentive to be less evil in order to convince those voters to come back.

            On the other hand, if the “lesser evil” feels safe that people are going to vote for them as long as they’re less evil than the other evil candidate there’s really nothing holding them back from being 99.9% as evil as the greater evil. In fact, becoming almost as evil as the other guy becomes the rational strategy for appealing to centrist voters who could opt for the greater evil if the lesser evil is not seen as being evil enough.

            This has the further effect of moving the Overton window to the right as you know have two very evil candidates taking up public space and attention, thereby normalising the greater evil access pushing public opinion towards more evil.

            Politicians might all be evil off-putting losers but they’re not idiots. They’re rational actors seeking to maximise personal gains. By declaring that you will vote for somebody no matter what they do you’re effectively telling them not to pay attention to you and to spend their efforts courting the right instead.

            On the other hand by being willing to withhold your vote, thereby causing the “lesser evil” to lose, you’re putting a price tag on your support, giving them an incentive to be less evil.

            Of course this effect is greatest the less safe the seat in question is. If either evil candidate has a safe seat and is expected to win with a huge majority, voting for either evil, voting third party or not voting at all becomes pointless as public input is no longera meaningful part of the political process.

                  • SmokinStalin [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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                    3 months ago

                    I mean not really. Its more controlled by the dnc/rnc corporations. They set the only two options people get to choose between. And both of those options do the bidding of the same donors.

                    Like a teacher letting students vote on new paint color for the room. “Would you like to paint the room pastel purple or lavender?”

                    The students could vote for green(and maybe most of them prefer that if) they wanted but most don’t even veiw that as an option because of the structure.

          • Nakoichi [they/them]@hexbear.net
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            3 months ago

            from what I’ve heard

            See you don’t even live here. You have no fuckin idea what you are talking about, and as others have already told you in detail it doesn’t matter anyway. Direct action is what we have.

      • D61 [any]@hexbear.net
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        3 months ago

        One of the big “reasons to vote for Biden” was because he wasn’t Trump and it would be a return to “normal”.

        Then the 2024 election got closer and everybody forgot that Biden was just supposed to be a place holder and started crowing about how he’s the “greatest most progressivest president evah!” when he absolutely wasn’t. The Dems and their supporters decided that “no, because Biden won the 2020 election it was ACTUALLY because everybody was voting FOR Biden instead of AGAINST Trump” and got all butt hurt when people pointed out that “maybe the Dems should have spent 4 years getting a better candidate ready to run for President with a D by their name in 2024” because Biden kinda sucks.

        So, no, voting “just to vote” isn’t something that is a zero sum game. If you are voting for a candidate that you don’t want to win to try to keep some other candidate from winning, the only thing that the candidate sees is that somebody voted for them. Once they win, they don’t need to listen to you anymore.

      • SmokinStalin [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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        3 months ago

        Spending 4 hours at a homeless shelter or comforting a random crackhead on the street will be a greater net good for the world than spending 4 hours in line to vote for my preffered genocidal maniac.

      • Black_Mald_Futures [any]@hexbear.net
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        3 months ago

        You stupid motherfuckers fucking giving legitimacy to the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie by participating in its elections, giving direct sanction to our ruling class, makes it almost impossible to fucking do anything, you dumb piece of shit

        You put us in a position where violent revolution is the only option to cause real change, but you’re the same dumb fucks who cheer and oink as the cops murder us, so thanks for nothing, fucker