Schumer relented one day after vowing that Senate Democrats would thwart the "partisan" measure, saying the "chaos" of a government shutdown would be a worse option.
I love how these conversations happen many times every session, but then campaign time comes and everyone calls me a Russian asset for reminding people of what the “Blue No Matter Who” mentality gets you.
How long do I have to wait for this to work? It’s been 25 years of voting blue no matter who and Republicans are just getting more and more power. When do we get to say that’s a failed strategy? When there’s no elections anymore or when there’s only one party on the ballot?
Oh, wait, that happens a ton already because Democrats are fucking useless. Three seats on my 2024 ballot had Republicans running unopposed.
It HAS worked. Do you know how bad it would’ve been had we had Republican after Republican?? It would’ve been project 2000.
Damage has been mitigated. Progress has been made. If you don’t appreciate that, then I’m happy for you because it means you are well of enough to not notice.
What primaries? The Democrats invented superdelegates to subvert democracy in the primary process, and then argued in court in Florida that it was their right to do so when they were sued for it.
depends on what you mean by, " get more involved in the only party"
If you mean gut the dems and start over with 100% new leadership and without being at the behest of the rich, I’m in. Otherwise its a pointless pantomime and I’m not interested in playing along in corpo-fascist games any longer.
It is a good point, and I’m not advocating for doing nothing, just acknowledging that change via the Democrats is impossible. Unless you’ve been asleep for 40 years, you’re well aware that real, meaningful change is impossible in this party duopoly, and nothing underscores that more than running a publicly brain-dead man and the entire “progressive” party apparatus lining up behind him in order to suit his fragile, stupid ego.
What I advocate for is doing good with one’s own two hands, because that’s always possible. Be willing to pick up dog shit even if it’s not yours. When someone in your building asks for a favor, be generous with your time. When ICE comes knocking, and they will, find that maybe you have difficulty remembering things. (And if you really want to underscore how shitty the Democrats are, remember that Tom Homan was also Obama’s guy.)
The Democrats in Washington do not give a fuck about you, me, our families, or anyone else. They exist to do performative things and make nice speeches, then go vote in a manner that can be charitably called conservative but more often enables fascism. For example, remember when they did their nice little stunt kneeling in Congress with their African wear? Those same Democrats linked up behind Biden when he wanted to militarize the police even more.
The only power you or I have is local unless you’re willing to commit an extraordinary act of vigilantism or you’re a billionaire. That’s it.
I can tell you’ve never had to sweep or shovel with something when half the haft is gone. Or tear the lid off a garbage can because the mechanism to lift the lid stopped working.
That’s what I’ve always had to work with when it comes to representatives in this country. It’s cuz you and your neo liberal Democratic friends think the rest of us don’t deserve working equipment. Only your Rich donors do.
Liberals are, for all their talk, in a Stockholm Syndrome kind of love with the DNC. BlueMAGA is some combination of a death cult and an abusive relationship.
So your criticism of liberals is… they vote for the party the most closely aligns with their views? And this is somehow analogous to death cults and MAGA extremism?
It doesn’t align with their views; that’s the whole problem. Liberals carry water for the DNC even though they hate the nonsense it does as much as everyone else. At least I don’t think I’ve seen anyone around here say that Biden supporting genocide* or not going after price gouging were good things. It’s always excuses, “lesser” evils and false dichotomies to make sure the Democrats are always just good enough to not throw aside. That’s why I likened it to the Stockholm Syndrome.
That’s still not analogous to MAGA extremism, Democrats have much more favorable social policies, which is what most Americans care about. Voting for the party that does more about the values you care about is not a death cult unless you think basic LGBT rights are a death cult.
Now that I think about it I was using liberal to mean DNC supporter and I’m pretty sure that’s a misnomer (though there likely is significant overlap) so I’ll say DNC supporter from now on. Also what I personally call blue MAGA is only a subset of DNC “supporters” (since most of them are closer to willing hostages, at least around here). My personal blue MAGA line is actually thinking the DNC is a competent or honest political party despite being shown evidence to the contrary or has some kind of right to people’s votes. “America didn’t vote for them so they have no duty to act/America clearly wants fascism” rhetoric and thinking accepting genocide was competent electoral strategy (again despite being shown evidence to the contrary) also fall under this. They also like to claim Bernie’s losses in 2016 and 2020 were “the will of the voters” rather than the result of DNC tampering. Edit: Seeing a headline about genocide in Palestine and writing something to the effect of “Gaza voters bad” is also a pretty clear tell.
That’s still not analogous to MAGA extremism,
The blue MAGA comparison isn’t about extremism; it’s about other hallmark MAGA traits like tribalism, enforcement of ideological homogeneity, vilification and mocking of critics and uncritical support for “us” over “them”. For what I consider emblematic blue MAGA behavior, remember how in the lead up to the election everyone critical of Biden and later Harris or the DNC was called a Russian troll or MAGA in disguise? Yeah, it’s that. So yeah, they’re called blue MAGA because they’re perfectly willing to imitate MAGA when it suits them. Fortunately the number of blue MAGAs (as opposed to willing hostages) shrunk since then, but you’ll still see a few of them around.
unless you think basic LGBT rights are a death cult.
Within the context of the Western, and especially American, slide into fascism, people who want to stop that must do what works and ditch what doesn’t work. Well, we call argue all day about what works, but voting for the DNC and in DNC primaries doesn’t. Bernie 2020 and their abandonment of Jamal Bowman are all proof needed for that. And what do you call a group of people who insist on and defend walking a path down which only their misery lies? Because I call that a death cult. Whether one realizes that (the willing hostages) or chooses not to (blue MAGA) is irrelevant.
I love how these conversations happen many times every session, but then campaign time comes and everyone calls me a Russian asset for reminding people of what the “Blue No Matter Who” mentality gets you.
This is the proper attitude for primaries, not general elections.
The time to have that conversation is before and during the primaries. After that, it’s not a worthwhile conversation.
The message isn’t the issue, your timing is.
How long do I have to wait for this to work? It’s been 25 years of voting blue no matter who and Republicans are just getting more and more power. When do we get to say that’s a failed strategy? When there’s no elections anymore or when there’s only one party on the ballot?
Oh, wait, that happens a ton already because Democrats are fucking useless. Three seats on my 2024 ballot had Republicans running unopposed.
It HAS worked. Do you know how bad it would’ve been had we had Republican after Republican?? It would’ve been project 2000.
Damage has been mitigated. Progress has been made. If you don’t appreciate that, then I’m happy for you because it means you are well of enough to not notice.
Youy know why Schumer said he wouldnt fight and voted with the republicans?
“Harm reduction”.
Sound familiar?
He’s a failure.
Harm reduction isn’t 100% of possible harm reduction.
I’m not saying they’re good. I’m saying they’re useful and sometimes not horrible.
So it works when a fascist is elected eventually rather than immediately.
Gotcha.
LOL
What primaries? The Democrats invented superdelegates to subvert democracy in the primary process, and then argued in court in Florida that it was their right to do so when they were sued for it.
Good point. Better to do nothing then. Give up.
Or get more involved in the only party with a chance and change them from the inside?
No, that sounds like work. Forget it.
depends on what you mean by, " get more involved in the only party"
If you mean gut the dems and start over with 100% new leadership and without being at the behest of the rich, I’m in. Otherwise its a pointless pantomime and I’m not interested in playing along in corpo-fascist games any longer.
I love the idea. What’s the first step we can take to accomplish that?
It is a good point, and I’m not advocating for doing nothing, just acknowledging that change via the Democrats is impossible. Unless you’ve been asleep for 40 years, you’re well aware that real, meaningful change is impossible in this party duopoly, and nothing underscores that more than running a publicly brain-dead man and the entire “progressive” party apparatus lining up behind him in order to suit his fragile, stupid ego.
What I advocate for is doing good with one’s own two hands, because that’s always possible. Be willing to pick up dog shit even if it’s not yours. When someone in your building asks for a favor, be generous with your time. When ICE comes knocking, and they will, find that maybe you have difficulty remembering things. (And if you really want to underscore how shitty the Democrats are, remember that Tom Homan was also Obama’s guy.)
I agree. But my point is that the Democrats are the only tool we have at the moment within the government.
We have plenty of tools outside of the government, and you’re 100% right that we should use those as well.
But let’s not throw out the one tool we have inside the government. Let’s improve it so it’s useful.
The devils in the details of that vague proposal. So, sure I guess.
That’s the thing, we don’t.
The Democrats in Washington do not give a fuck about you, me, our families, or anyone else. They exist to do performative things and make nice speeches, then go vote in a manner that can be charitably called conservative but more often enables fascism. For example, remember when they did their nice little stunt kneeling in Congress with their African wear? Those same Democrats linked up behind Biden when he wanted to militarize the police even more.
The only power you or I have is local unless you’re willing to commit an extraordinary act of vigilantism or you’re a billionaire. That’s it.
So join local Democrat groups
Democrats blame progressives for their losses.
A broken tool is no tool at all
I can tell you’ve never had to sweep or shovel with something when half the haft is gone. Or tear the lid off a garbage can because the mechanism to lift the lid stopped working.
That’s what I’ve always had to work with when it comes to representatives in this country. It’s cuz you and your neo liberal Democratic friends think the rest of us don’t deserve working equipment. Only your Rich donors do.
/c/im14andthisisdeep
Do we have Democrats as a tool inside the government? Are you sure they aren’t another of the oligarchs’ tools?
It’s both. And they’re the most likely group that we could turn to our purposes.
You’re either with the oligarchs or you’re with the terrorists
Oof
Liberals are, for all their talk, in a Stockholm Syndrome kind of love with the DNC. BlueMAGA is some combination of a death cult and an abusive relationship.
BlueMAGA sounds like weak bothsidesism, come up with some real criticism
The whole thread and all the rest of lemmy is full of real criticism. So maybe take your own advice before you attack that person.
I did.
So your criticism of liberals is… they vote for the party the most closely aligns with their views? And this is somehow analogous to death cults and MAGA extremism?
It doesn’t align with their views; that’s the whole problem. Liberals carry water for the DNC even though they hate the nonsense it does as much as everyone else. At least I don’t think I’ve seen anyone around here say that Biden supporting genocide* or not going after price gouging were good things. It’s always excuses, “lesser” evils and false dichotomies to make sure the Democrats are always just good enough to not throw aside. That’s why I likened it to the Stockholm Syndrome.
*well Zionists think so but screw them
That’s still not analogous to MAGA extremism, Democrats have much more favorable social policies, which is what most Americans care about. Voting for the party that does more about the values you care about is not a death cult unless you think basic LGBT rights are a death cult.
Now that I think about it I was using liberal to mean DNC supporter and I’m pretty sure that’s a misnomer (though there likely is significant overlap) so I’ll say DNC supporter from now on. Also what I personally call blue MAGA is only a subset of DNC “supporters” (since most of them are closer to willing hostages, at least around here). My personal blue MAGA line is actually thinking the DNC is a competent or honest political party despite being shown evidence to the contrary or has some kind of right to people’s votes. “America didn’t vote for them so they have no duty to act/America clearly wants fascism” rhetoric and thinking accepting genocide was competent electoral strategy (again despite being shown evidence to the contrary) also fall under this. They also like to claim Bernie’s losses in 2016 and 2020 were “the will of the voters” rather than the result of DNC tampering. Edit: Seeing a headline about genocide in Palestine and writing something to the effect of “Gaza voters bad” is also a pretty clear tell.
The blue MAGA comparison isn’t about extremism; it’s about other hallmark MAGA traits like tribalism, enforcement of ideological homogeneity, vilification and mocking of critics and uncritical support for “us” over “them”. For what I consider emblematic blue MAGA behavior, remember how in the lead up to the election everyone critical of Biden and later Harris or the DNC was called a Russian troll or MAGA in disguise? Yeah, it’s that. So yeah, they’re called blue MAGA because they’re perfectly willing to imitate MAGA when it suits them. Fortunately the number of blue MAGAs (as opposed to willing hostages) shrunk since then, but you’ll still see a few of them around.
Within the context of the Western, and especially American, slide into fascism, people who want to stop that must do what works and ditch what doesn’t work. Well, we call argue all day about what works, but voting for the DNC and in DNC primaries doesn’t. Bernie 2020 and their abandonment of Jamal Bowman are all proof needed for that. And what do you call a group of people who insist on and defend walking a path down which only their misery lies? Because I call that a death cult. Whether one realizes that (the willing hostages) or chooses not to (blue MAGA) is irrelevant.
It is very culty.