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Jesus what I wouldn’t give to see Trump in that orange suit flanked by all of those cops.
I love this place. Post anything about this on reddit and it’s likely to be removed if it gets too positive or the bots downvote it.
Reddit is a place to promote product. This isn’t product. Give it time and big lemmy servers will turn into reddit, but for now we get to enjoy a safe space.
Thankfully, because of the way Lemmy is built, we will forever have smaller communities that don’t turn into garbage like that.
Reddit let this thing run first week as they couldn’t moderate the sentiment this strong but looks like after that they cracked down.
Lemmy world news sub was suppressing this very aggressively during that time.
Mods dropped in in unrelated sub threatening to remove the discussion if we didn’t keep it “civil”
Some clown ass behavior.
Why is it terrorism when rich people are killed?
Cause they only care when rich scum are terrorized.
Who controls the present now controls the past.
Terrorism is supposed to be the dogmatic or ideologically motivated killing of civilians, often by those who are willing to die in the process. It’s terror inducing because it could seemingly happen anywhere at any time to any one, and it’s a lot easier to cause harm to others when you’re suicidal and not trying to get away with it.
Of course, that’s not how it’s routinely used, or perhaps was ever really used by anyone except academics.
If it’s politically motivated I’m pretty sure it’s terrorism.
The NY charge calls for a specific action taken against a government entity.
Unless UHC is part of the government, but corporations as government is Musolini style fascism, and the US isn’t a fascist country, right?
But is it politically motivated?
He was pissed his claim was denied.
I’d say that yes it was definitely at least partially politically motivated, since it was just as much an attack against the system as it was against the person, but hardly terrorism since there was no intent to scare the general public.
He probably did intend to scare insurance company executives. I can see calling it terrorism, even if I think he should get off.
I’ve dealt with back pain, and during the height of my battle with the insurer I absolutely would’ve been tempted to kill the fuckers given the chance.
insurance company executives
Yes but they are not civilians, the are enemy combatants so it is fair game.
Also Luigi if he did it, literally spared witness who is in fact a civilians.
Terrorism charge will hopefully back fire.
So, I’ve heard he didn’t actually have UHC. There’s also no confirmation of a denied claim, just the fact that he had back pain. Luigi targeted Brian because UHC was the largest insurance provider in the country, not because he was personally denied a particular claim. The guy was doing long distance hiking and running months before the slaying.
TrueAnon podcast has a great deep dive into who Luigi was and what his potential motives were.
He’s got a background in Effective Altruism, he got into the Dark Enlightenment movement, and was involved with a number of Silicon Valley gurus with particularly extremist ideology.
Far from simply being an unhappy customer, it’s likely he’s a real life “Radical Centrist” who got pilled on far center neoliberal ideology.
Wtf is far center?
It’s a bit like far-left or far-right, except it manages to get bipartisan approval.
z axis moment
Bad analysis since far center neo lib would be LARPing violence is never the answer lol
I mean he wrote words on bullets (or casings, I dunno) and a manifesto…
….so? How many killers before him have written a manifesto? Are all these school shooters, attacking actual public schools, being charged with terrorism? They’re actually striking out at “the system.” How many white supremacists mass shootings have written manifestos and not been charged with terrorism?
Are all these school shooters, attacking actual public schools, being charged with terrorism?
There’s little need to up-charge school shooters. Many of them are killed on sight. Those that are captured (Dylan Roof, for instance) get life without parole or the death sentence.
But in NYC, a single murder without a terrorist motive only gets you to 2nd Degree Murder. That means you’ll be out in 15 years. The “terrorism” addendum is necessary for life without parole sentencing.
Yes, but the charges should fit the crime not be selected to ensure the desired outcome
There is no objective measure of criminal conduct. It’s all malleable. Prosecutors and judges and juries ultimately make these decisions case-by-case. And the results can be heavily weighted by wealthy, socially influential private interests who want to see an example made of a particularly offensive or terrifying individual.
American soldiers regularly paint imagery and words on the ammunition and vehicles they use to kill people. Are they terrorists too?
The military is political. It is literally policy when the military moves. Anything any military does is dictionary terrorism. But terrorism is a nasty word for it so we don’t call it that.
Makes sense
I mean, yes. But folks here aren’t ready for that conversation
Don’t worry I agree lol
In some instances, absolutely.
I mean I’d agree lol but I doubt this person equates Luigi and the average American soldier painting a bomb. That’s my point. Writing on a bullet case or writing a political statement doesn’t make one terrorist. It’s the violent acts and who they’re directed at any why that determine it.
Yes
sigh yes you’re the third or fourth person to make this joke. Yes I agree.
The point is that nobody calls them terrorists for doing that. Putting words or art on weapons and ammo is considered “normal” as twisted as that is. So Luigi’s doing it does not make him a terrorist.
Yeah I mean it’s obviously trumped-up bullshit in his case, they’re making a point of throwing the book at him any way they can because the owners got their jimmies rustled
‘Terrorism’ is just a word for anything the state doesn’t like.
Is the second guy who tried to shoot trump being charged with terrorism? Because that was politically motivated.
If he’s not, Luigi also does not deserve the charge.
Was the first guy charged?
No he’s dead.
Yeah right, forgot about that.
deleted by creator
Not even killed, but even just made to think their plundering might have consequences.
Brian Thompson pleaded guilty to drunk driving in 2017, the same month he became CEO.
Damnnn that is one interpretation of drunk driving. "officer, you don’t understand, drunk driving putting everyones life and freedom at risk is what makes us human
Buying a second house for your estranged wife is very normal. I’ve got tons of very real, normal human friends that buy their wives second houses because divorce would cost more than a second house.
The person is very human, yes.
No wonder he thought he knew better than doctors - his penmanship was for shit.
I write in block letters and he is a shit writer.
I write in cursive enchanting table and I couldn’t decipher that.
I think they want to intimidate others, but honestly giving him this much of a spotlight should be the dream of anyone thinking about attacking another CEO for attention.
I don’t see how they don’t see it.
Maybe the cops are playing both sides? I’m definitely giving them too much credit there, but maybe?
While I’m sure there is no love lost towards healthcare execs from even the police, an uptick of “terrorism” could also be used as an excuse to give even more power to the police as well.
I was thinking they are playing it up in hopes of copycats. Basically malicious compliance
copycats
Don’t tease me bro!
Our systems and hierarchies do often support the oligarchy, but that does not mean every single individual supports the oligarchy, or that every single thing our systems do are meant to advance the goals of the ultra rich. Sometimes individuals who participate in these systems do malicious compliance, sometimes they don’t comply at all.
In this case there could be someone high-up who is empathetic(or a group of empathetic people unaware of each other, their actions adding up) whose decisions led to this happening, or this could have just been a dumb decision, who knows.
I dont think they need an excuse, they just do whatever they want now. Thats what electing trump is all about, letting them run amuck unrestrained.
That’s definitely giving them too much credit.
They are probably trying to reduce the number of eligible jurors who would acquit him.
Insurers fuck cops over too. While I doubt it’s an act of solidarity with the rest of us peasants, it could actually be an enemy-of-my-enemy situation where cops find themselves hating UHC as much as the rest of us.
How crazy would it be if the next Luigi is a cop?!
This is the same country that tries to fight radicals in other countries by invading, oppressing, and ultimately creating more radicals. Our elite have little understanding of the socially deviant
Because their jobs financing is mostly perception based.
Crime can be at an all time low, but all it takes is a politician to rile up the population about murderers and law enforcement and incarceration will end up getting more money.
Be seen as being ineffective, soft or incompetent, especially by those holding the purse strings, and people lose jobs to those who will toe the line.
This is a message to the wealthy “look how seriously we take serving you”
I have had a lot of opportunities to post this lately, so here we go again:
They rather kill defenseless children.
They are probably also scared of people trying to free him since he is quite popular. This isn’t generally the case for other suspects.
There’s 2 possible reasons to have “military” escort. either…
- They must protect the perp from assassination.
- They must prevent mob from liberating him.
That’s why they all had armor and he didn’t. It is number 2.
There is a vibe for caption of “are we the baddies?” to this.
I mean both really
Ain’t no one assassinating him.
I mean his fellow prisoners were calling out free Luigi. Some Fox news idiots thought that being a CEO killer was akin to being a child molester who kills kids when he’s done raping them.
They didn’t realize that being wealthy and ruthless in that pursuit wasn’t something they idolized.
United health probably wants to.
But legally.
Reminds me of that saying “don’t kill the messenger”. Maybe the guy was under the influence of drugs. Maybe the guy was not under the influence of some drugs. We can’t just allow him to be tossed into death row. I assume?
Jesus on his way to be crucified because he spoke up for poor people
All they’re doing is making him look like a badass. They need enough cops to suppress Superman if he turned bad.
The managerial class really is terrified, huh?
If the cops arrested Superman it wouldn’t be because he went bad.
They sure do love taking and posting pictures of him and then yelling at people to not give him any press. How many pics have we seen of him in custody? They dont want coverage of him silenced, they want to control that narrative. US justice system is a sad broken dishonest state of affairs.
Every day Trump walks free has been sad proof of that
Pigs when other pigs choke people to death: I sleep
Pigs when someone touches a mass murdering elite: Real shit
Pigs when someone touches the guy who pays their off-the-books salary: Real shit
Ftfy
If they bring out a regiment to guard your show trial you’re almost certainly on the right side of history.
Probably.
90%
Right side of History, sure, but,
For it’s the end of history
It’s caged and frozen still
There is no other pill to take
So swallow the one
That made you ill
you know, that the end of history crap is what that song criticizes, making it a really strange way to reply to someone saying something is on the right side of history.
Thanks for clarifying. I always thought he meant that our masters were pretending history had stopped and we were frozen in the current moment forever so nothing they do matters.
I love that Adams is there. He literally has no reason to be there other than self promotion. Do you think they discussed the finer points of being indicted federally? Maybe he is trying to get him to ask for a Trump pardon.
“look at what this man did, not what i’ve done!”
-adams, prob
I guess he’s trying to learn more about prison life before he gets his own perp walk.
He is absolutely doing this to appease trump. Dude is getting hit with terrorism charges here to set up precedent for trump to do whatever the fuck he wants.
Lotta cops for a little kid with a busted back
He was a lone wolf and they’re acting like the Mafia might come to free him any moment
Mafia should do something useful for once
Honestly the mafia should free him. Why not? Insurance companies are impeding on the mafias protection racket lol.
They acting like the whole country wants to kill him when it’s the complete opposite.
Yeah, the thing that’s shocked me is how my most capitalist liberal friends are in agreement he did nothing wrong. Like some of them are even agreeing when I use the phrase “class warfare”
I never liked those shoes. They are like a bad knock off of toms. Somehow they even make shittier crocs for jails as well… I remember walking into a Walmart and a guy being like “yo when did you serve” as I was buying a pair of entnies (didn’t know they sold them there, but they were like $25) to finish my 19 mile walk home. Wasn’t sure how he knew at first, then realized he remembered those shitty shoes as well.
(Things not to do in life, get pulled out of bed in the middle of the night by police wearing no shoes and forced to walk across a stone driveway.)
Innocent until proven guilty time and time again proves to be not how our system works. Alleged charges were dismissed and expunged. The impact on my life, not able to be taken back.
Yeah, the criminal justice system in the U.S. causes immeasurable harm. From a probation system designed to keep you in the system, to kids-for-cash-like schemes that I’m convinced are more common than has been prosecuted, to coercive delay tactics. All of which I have personal experience with. I’ve currently been out on bail for 2 years, and someone else in my county has been in jail without trial for 5 years because he can’t afford bail. Not to mention the horrible conditions in many jails and prisons, slave labor, nearly complete lack of rehabilitation, and the system milking the incarcerated’s families for money. I can’t think of any other word to describe it than evil.
I worked government contracts in IT for the last 10 years mostly. After the allegation I failed 3 background checks coming back saying conviction when the case was retired and moved to be dismissed. My entire career was shot save for a 9 month contract I got where they overroad the background check with a lawyers response showing it was a false response on the conviction and due to costs I have literally nothing left. After lawyers and shit… 0 savings, 0 401k, contract over now, took a job for a distributor for a well known brand to pay bills… No background check. Even Kroger’s background check failed me when the case has already been dismissed. It destroyed my life, and I did nothing.
That’s some Kafka-tier bullshit, wtf.
I only know him from literature and trivia questions poised in the U.S.
Care to explain what that means to me? If you don’t want to say so here you can dm me. Truth is often hard to find these days. (AI responses, monetary/ad responses / keyword manipulation)
Kafka wrote stories about confusing, impersonal bureaucracies. So people will describe something as Kafkaesque to convey that sense of being lost in a system.
Specifically in The Trial dude was judged and persecuted by the state without anyone even explaining to him what he did.
Because he didn’t cry at his mother’s funeral, right?
Yeah, the company I was working at got bought out and then they layed the entire tech team and pretty much everyone else. Co-founded a business with coworkers, but it’s not bringing in any revenue and not sure it ever will bring in very much, so have been applying to jobs. Only got a few interviews, then ghosted afterwards. I’m guessing a part of it is I have a criminal charge pending, and the first thing you see on Google when you search my name and town is one of those mugshot websites. Maybe I should go into construction, lol.
Yeah, you should. Go into the trades in general. I got into hospital installation work nine years ago and it changed my life. I went from making 36k a year to 45k immediately because I went from salary food service management working 60 to 70 hours to hourly working 40 to 50 plus paid travel. Contractor work so no time and a half overtime. If I had been working for an hourly wage at my salary job, then I tripled it for less work, no managing people, and so so much less stress.
I learned so many skills I can’t put a dollar value on. One of the ones I can was low voltage cabling. I’m not trying to boast when I say I’m one of the best at this in a hospital setting in the United States. It’s a small field. I don’t make nearly as much as a master electrician would with my experience but I didn’t have to do an official apprenticeship and don’t have any kind of license other than OSHA and shit like scissor lift.
This might sound stupid but maybe contact local media? TV especially. They might like to do a segment on you. You can obviously speak professionally and hopefully still dress the part and plead your case. This is a long shot, but it could actually get it fixed.
How much is the guy’s bail? If you throw money at it, I will too. It’s your duty to your fellow man for equity. It’s probably more than we can afford but I’m just thinking. Maybe we can seed a fund.
Looked it up, and looks like a local criminal justice reform non-profit bailed him out earlier this year. Looks like he’s still awaiting trial though, is on an ankle monitor, and they keep resetting dismissal hearing dates.
I went to sentencing for a misdemeanor and all I took in my pockets were like 10 quarters for the phone because I knew I was only in a couple days or week max but they let you out when they feel like it. My girlfriend was going to come get me when I got out. This wasn’t totally before cell phones but I didn’t have one at the time.
They took my quarters when I got to jail.
Break for Pro-Tip: if you know you’re going to jail, even just for the night or until you make bail and not gen pop, don’t take any money if you can avoid it. They call it the “jail fee” and steal all your paper money (or quarters in my case). I once hid my cash in my sock when I knew I was going to drunk tank and the guy was going through my wallet. He asked me where was my money. I told him I threw it out the window of the police car. Back to the story.
I couldn’t believe they took my fucking phone quarters. They let me out in the middle of the night in December. There were two COs getting off work and I tried to beg a couple quarters to use the phone. They just laughed at me. I didn’t bring a jacket or anything, it was warmish when I went to court. By now it’s about 40 degrees. Lucky I guess, back then it got a lot colder a lot more often.
So I start walking. It’s 10 miles. Try to hitchhike for a while then give up. It starts raining. This is the point where I considered laying down in the ditch to die. I realized it would take too long to die and kept on. Nobody walking on the road. This is a state road that runs beside the highway and doesn’t have much on it. I went into a gas station to try to use their phone and they told me to fuck off. I went into a McDonald’s and they let me get a free water. I ended up walking to my girlfriend’s apartment which was about 16 blocks closer than my place. I walked in, climbed into bed and she woke up saying what the fuck why didn’t you call me?
Man, what assholes.
I was at a “know your rights” training thing for protesters and activists, and one of the things that they covered is that a super important and low risk thing way to support a large protest is to have people sort of “on guard” nearby the police station, ready to receive and support someone who was arrested, because the police like to release people at stupid times of night (especially if they’re salty that they don’t have enough evidence to charge you for a crime). In most cases though, (such as yours), there’s no-one to provide this support, and then you’re fucked.
I hadn’t realised how prevalent this spitefulness was until this part of the training , where multiple people shared experiences of this sort. I was already on team ACAB as it was.
I’m glad you made it home safe.
I really don’t understand why cops think we should like them. Like they treat the accused like shit, even when not guilty, they’re just awful to the victims, and half the time you see them they’re on a power trip.
I hate that not only do I believe you I’m not even surprised.
I’m currently reading Danny Coughlin’s Bad Dream which is a short story by Stephen King about an innocent person accused of a crime. He had a similar line about “whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?”
That’s the fun part about that picture above, that is a picture of how they treat an innocent man. He hasn’t been convicted of anything. They never would have had all new oranges like that for him if it wasn’t for the number of cameras they knew would show up.
Exactly, the cops will pull out all the stops to convince you that the accused are criminals and the media happily plays along. Luigi Mangionie has no conviction and as an American is therefore innocent for the time being. The cops don’t want you thinking of this as them parading an innocent man like that. They routinely violate and abuse the accused, and in cases like this they’re trying to ensure that the public, potential jurors, go in with the assumption that he’s the individual who killed Brian Thompson. They treat not guilty verdicts as “criminals going free” rather than “innocence being decided” and they treat jurisprudence as a hindrance to justice rather than a foundation of it.
The cops believe all they see to be guilty by virtue of falling under their gaze. And they get angry you don’t celebrate them for it.
I want to upvote this more than once. Younger people I believe say based, but at 35 I still lack the vocabulary to properly say I agree with this opinion profoundly without fear of coming across to eager or strange.
(Starting to think I have anxiety issues after reflecting upon that)
It’s cool lol, this was one of my half lunch break rambles. And I totally get the anxiety lol
But yeah the fact is that if cops want to be liked and safe they need to make it easy and beneficial to comply and to follow the rules. As it stands if they decide you’re a bad person who’s committed a bad crime they’ll ruin your fucking life if not end it. So if they can’t catch the people who commit violent crimes against people like me or even bother to pretend to try, but they can decide to kill someone for running away from them despite none of the accused crimes being potentially capital offenses, then what are they for. If they can ruin your life on a hunch then the only thing stopping people from being violent towards them is that most people aren’t violent unless pressed.
I can see ways forward for American policing, but they all require the police to display a humility, vulnerability, accountability, and restraint that I’ve never seen from them. It will require them to learn the law, follow it, and accept punishment when they break it. It will require them to embrace a duty to protect all people in their jurisdiction, including both the accused and convicted. It will require them to see their job as impartial collection of evidence for the only entity that has the right to determine guilt: a jury consisting of the peers of the accused. It will require them to argue for evidence based legislation and justice that seeks to minimize harm to both victims and the convicted. And it’s going to require them to be ok with the dangers inherent to their profession where not accepting those dangers puts the rest of us in danger, because that’s what everyone else in a dangerous job does. And it’ll also require them to have mandatory therapy where the therapists can put them on paperwork duty because that’s obviously something they need, we shouldn’t have traumatized gunmen with a license to kill for a police force, but currently we’re preloading them with trauma responses as training and probably barring them from therapy because that’s how we handle mental health in this country.
Sigh, i just want this world to be better and I understand that it’s not easy. But that doesn’t mean it’s impossible or not worth trying.
I’m sure our opinions differ on many things, but this reminds me of when I get on rants talking about how things could be better as well. I hope you know you are loved by those you will never meet, and please keep trying to see that light and hope. It doesn’t look like the class war is going away any time soon, so punches will keep coming… just please keep standing back up. Maybe one of us will win a billion+ dollar lottery somehow and build a sanctuary city in the middle of nowhere where we can start it all fresh, build it ethically, set up our own healthcare system for the growing city, therapy and help for those coming in and our own policing force to ensure our safety. Ban the construction by large corporations, gas powered vehicles from entering the city and set up public transportation and ensure most of the city is set up walkable without need for cars so everyone can safely and quickly reach their destinations.
Eventually have just a safe haven where we recycle the initial funds only spending the investments on its expansion. As businesses make money and people are healthier and happier, other cities would likely try to copy some of those things to dispel people leaving there and try to make their own cities nicer.
Hope you have a wonderful life stranger : )
Terry?
Wait etnies are prison shoes? They are by far my favourite brand of shoes lol
I was buying $25 etnies from Walmart on a walk home from jail wearing the knock off Toms jail shoes.
Hard to tell in the picture but if you zoom in you can see them, the way his toe is lifted makes the bottom look larger(white area) than they really are. (Some would call them bath shoes for jails)
https://youtube.com/shorts/JFJYMBPfTn4
Because someone can get rich(er) off others suffering
Comically enough I took a 3 month contract with a company a couple years back. They run private prisons around the U.S. I left and didn’t extend or take a position for what some would say are “woke” ideals. But one of the reasons was that if a doctor has their medical license suspended for malpractice, I found out they are ALLOWED to practice medicine in private prisons. So some of the worst doctors who do nefarious shit would get suspended for it, and they would take a job for the prison systems to make money and not be investigated by proper review boards until they could get their standing back. I know this because I would have to verify errors in their systems pertaining to drug prescription purchases that would be illegal to send to any other doctor in the U.S., but would be allowed there.
Can we stop having school shooters and make this a trend instead? 🙏🏾
