Man, the size of brains of people calling someone racist just because they vote right, completely unaware of their own contribution in this matter. Guess, anyone who doesn’t vote right is antifa
Hi german here, the AfD is judicialy allowed to be called a Faschist party :) And are racist and their votes are too
Plus many CDU/CSU voters and members are too
If you vote for racists, then you are racist. It’s as simple as that.
Exactly. Just because they say the same stuff, want the same changes and behave the same way as racists, doesnt mean theyre racists!
I was told by a German person on this very site that they’d never go right wing again because of a unique type of centrism in the country that’s hugely popular and that my tiny American brain couldn’t comprehend. Oh well, guess that’s just another common centrist L.
I don’t want to start a war or anything but as someone from neither the USA or Europe, Europeans online often come across as even more exceptionalist than Americans, despite the reputation to the contrary. Because, at least in leftish or liberal spaces, no one is more ready to shit on and call out the USA than Americans. And I don’t mean they’re anti-American or whatever, they just want their country to be better, so they call out all the shit.
Europeans on the other hand often seem more proud and / or defensive about their countries. Maybe they speak openly in their own country specific communities but I don’t get the sense that they’re as open and friendly to outside input or criticism as the Americans are.
The way I see it, we’re all hooked onto the same stream of memes and billionaire owned news sources everywhere across the world. So thinking we’re immune to being overtaken by dangerous alt right nonsense and ignoring all the obvious signs would be a very stupid move, wherever you are. If they’re not taking this seriously, they’re doing exactly what the Americans did and have done since 2016.
Centrism is just seeing an elephant about to step on a mouse and trying to make a compromise.
to be fair, this is the image the center parties have and upkeep. I, as a farly left person, already question if this seperation to right extremism will still be upheld in 4 years. Our Center-right partie CDU falls more and more for populist rethoric, which reminds me of the republicans or the toris.
So what you have been told is not wrong per se. But there is a significant amount of people in the country and politicans in the parlaiment, that argue the seperation between right exremism and center parties did already collaps behind the scenes.
Third time’s a charm!
There are more fucking neo-Nazis in the USA than in Germany. The shit AfD voters come from the Oklahoma and Mississippi of Germany, Thuringia and Saxony.
Yeah, sorry, but that is like looking at the map in 1930 from these ones and saying “the NSDAP voters come from East Prussia only, don’t complain about the Nazis in Germany!”
Definitely not true. It sounds like you are German and if so it is pretty sad how little you keep up with your own election even though it happened just a few days ago. There are more AfD voters in eastern Germany but most Bundesländer have >18% AfD votes.
People tend to forget that Hitlers NSDAP only needed 18% in 1930 and a rigged election in 1933 to completely take over the country.
Coping doesnt get us anywhere. Its not always “the others” that vote far-right. Its the whole country, the educated just as well as the uneducated, the poor and the rich. Almost everyone has family members or friends that vote far-right and we need to talk to them, try to understand their motives and make them understand that AfD wants to make everything they fear 10 times worse.Yes however today there aren’t tools available anymore that hitler had to make this happen. Our constitution is now far better protected and isn’t as easily dismantled as the Weimar republic’s constitution. Still sucks that so many people voted for afd though
I heard that argument often, and it’s true that the same way and same “we essentially keep the old constitution alive completely and change laws in ways that were technically legal” as back then won’t work.
However, fascism - also in the 1930s already - also has strategies like: “Just doing illegal things and overstepping what your posts are allowed to do, knowing you can only be stopped by force, even if judges and your superiors disagree.” That one was a massive part of how Hitler quickly outmanoeuvred von Papen, even though Papen was chancellor and Hitler “just” vice chancellor. The NSDAP-adjacent ministers, police chiefs, judges, etc. simply did not report to Papen, no matter what the law and constitution said.
What I am getting at: One should never think the laws on paper are some kind of shield and holy fact, only the laws as the executive (cops and courts, essentially) protects and enacts are what really matters, and those are corruptible, no matter how good the constitution is. (Another often quoted example: The constitution of North Korea also guarantees a lot of freedoms and rights, but no one would say, that protects the people there.)
Its better than back then, yes. But you cant know what kind of tricks they would use nowadays before it happens. Look at the US, Trump is doing whatever he wants no matter if its illegal. As long as hes not stopped by force, he will continue doing so.
The shit AfD voters come from the Oklahoma and Mississippi of Germany, Thuringia and Saxony.
That’s only kinda true. The east has way more Nazis, but just because the AfD is stronger there with 32% of the votes, doesn’t change the fact that 18% of West German voters voted for them too.
Both countries are full of neo nazi.
Is that per capita?
Fascism is really good for the rich to get richer
Especially the AfDs Neo-Liberal fascism ^^
Wouldn’t want anything bad to happen to our beloved overlords. 💰OTL
Once upon a time, I told a German that if their country goes fascist, we won’t spare them a second time. That was wrong and naive of me to say, but not too far off. There won’t be a rebuilding if that happens.
Calm your bloated tits! How about addressing the fascism in your own country first?
Don’t worry, we are adressing it as we speak. Let’s just say my country is also close enough to Germany to adress it as well.
Oh Im pretty sure we will be spared by the country that went full fascist just a few weeks ago. Thats definitely not the part Im worried about.
Only problem is that the entire worlds governments are going fascist. There won’t be anyone with enough power to fight them.
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“At least we’re not as racist as the US!”
“…yet.”
But we are working on yourself to catch up with the US.
Sadly true. Fuck the CDU and AfD. Nazi helpers and Nazis.
Did they make a coalition with the new nazi party?
Even if they don´t officially, they might just push through all the right wing policies with the votes of AfD.
The next weeks and months will show.
Ok because the last I saw, there was a “firewall” to stop any coalitions with them.
Personally, I don’t think even Merz is at the point just yet to outright create a coalition with them. However, that they did push a directive and try to push an actual law through parliament with AfD votes already is a sign of the direction things may end up going. Who knows, in a few months or years, there might just end up something happening like trouble in the most likely coming coalition of CDU/SPD, where the CDU just says they “had no choice” but to introduce a proto-fascist law that they and the AfD support, but the actual ruling coalition did not, resulting in legitimising them more and paving the way for an actual coalition.
I hate to say it, but i expect your prediction is what is going to happen.
Not yet, we will see in a few weeks
SPD and Grüne are helping the rise of fascism too even if it’s not on purpose. Die Linke are the only ones in parliament actually working against it.
Wanting to leave NATO, withholding weapons from Ukraine and talking to Putin isn’t exactly “working against” fascism. That’s very much the Neville Chamberlain approach … but even he came to his sense after the full scale invasion started. Can’t say the same for die Linke.
That’s very much the Neville Chamberlain approach …
That’s such revisionist history. Chamberlain wasn’t appeasing Germany, he was aligning with Germany against Communist Russia.
He wasn’t surrendering, he was allying with fascism.
Source?
That seems even more revisionist. If anything I’d have expected it from Winston “I believe in Aryan race science” Churchill.
Chamberlain was buying time for rearmament. It wasn’t actually necessary and it was, in fact, pretty fucking stupid because Germany was rearming faster than France and Britain put together, and his betrayal of Czechoslovakia with their fortified border was even more galling in face of it, but the idea wasn’t to ally with Germany as far as I’ve seen anyone claim.
NATO is a fascist organisation.
You Germs should know that since they incorporated plenty nazis in the organisation.https://www.dispropaganda.com/single-post/2019/04/04/natos-secret-nazi-past
Without NATO, we’re going back into the age of territorial conquests and nationalist revenge campaigns. Russia and China aren’t the only countries where this crap is normalized (see Hungary - lot of my fellow Hungarians thinks Slovaks are just Hungarians forced to take up a Slavic language, and in reality they’re just a lost tribe of Magyars called “the Tóths”).
NATO is territorial conquest by the US.
Europe are just vasals.
Campists these days are so funny, because now they’re getting all their opinions from the US state department.
NATO is liberal and that comes with all of the problems of liberals but in what ways has it functioned as a fascist organisation?
Don’t care, I’d rather live under the neolib European governments any day than a fascist Russian shithole. It’s not even a difficult choice. It’s not like there’s some leftist utopia as an alternative. The neolibs don’t murder gay people and don’t decriminalize violence against women as a state policy.
Don’t care, I’d rather live under the neolib European governments any day than a fascist Russian shithole.
I’ve got some horrible news for you.
The neolibs don’t murder gay people and don’t decriminalize violence against women as a state policy. LOL where do you get your news from?
That’s the fascist Banderites you support.
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2019/03/ukraine-activists-at-womens-solidarity-event-must-be-protected-from-attacks/Isn’t Amnesty an evil neoliberal org? Or are you a weird kind of tankie that doesn’t really have issue with it?
Regardless of that, it’s just like saying “Palestine deserved it” because Hamas and radical Islam.
I’m not going to react, your nonsense from your response says enough.
I’ll take government failures to control their pigs over actually siccing the murder pigs on the protestors.
I’m sure you can post proof of the government murdering womens marches, let’s see it
Had to protect the surplus profits of Capitalism at all costs. A century of wealth needed to be consolidated in the hands of the ubermensch. You know, Mohammed Bin Salmen and Amancio Ortega and Elon Musk.
Ok Tankie.
shouldn’t you be beating up anti-genocide protesters while doing the Musk salute?
A tankie on .world? Funny
We’re having all the fun ridiculing all the fash and the lib enablers.
Bold statement. Do you have any examples? I would disagree, but maybe I just don’t quite understand what you meant.
SPD is just standing by not doing anything (except being corrupt), basically silent complicity. The greens are also not clearly positioning themselves against the anti immigrant hatred, but they are still doing much better than the rest imo.
I agree with you on the SPD, but Habeck was pretty fucking clear that Abschiebung is not the way to go. The Linke on the other hand seems great until you see their position on NATO, rearmament, Russia, and Ukraine…
My dad literally voted for Volt instead of Grüne because “the Grüne was to positive about immigration”
I see peoples issues with the linke as largely unimportant. Having 9% of the seats taken by nato critical people is a healthy contra to the overwhelming majority that would never dare to criticize their sometimes criticism worthy decisions. If you never have anyone looking at things from an outside perspective the governement will lose touch with reality.
Fair enough. While I myself wouldn’t vote for them, I do agree that they are by no means evil. Their position certainly may even be valuable, I concede. I don’t want my preferred party (the Grüne) to be the most radical left party, it’s always good to have an even more left party to balance things out. We don’t want to end up like the US, where even moderate things like universal healthcare are viewed as radical in the state. Democracy serves it’s purpose. In other words: you’ve pretty much convinced me (though I would still vote Grüne).
What should the SPD be doing?
Behave like social democrats, push to fund infrastructure and school upgrades (instead of defunding them), not have a leading candidate that was involved with the biggest tax fraud scheme in recent history, etc
I nisunderstood, I thought you were calling them to do something about AfD more directly.
The best way to fight fascism is with meaningful policy thay helps the working class. The best way to help it is proving that liberal democracy consists in getting to choose which party gets to enforce austerity this term
Considering that Putin is the biggest fascist threat for all of Europe, your statement is laughable. The Left agree that Putin is doing bad things in Ukraine and other countries but their message is that the domestic social net is more important than Europe’s survival and all weapon deliveries must stop. Let’s talk instead.
If policies were up to them, they’d be helping fascism almost as much as outright Putin sheep
How is Putin the biggest fascist threat for Europe? Fascism was literally born in Europe and exported elsewhere, we have Nazi and fascist parties getting consistent growth election after election in basically every EU country.
Believe it or not, Europe isn’t at war with Russia, we should be struggling in favour of diplomacy to reduce both our and their military expenditure… which is hard to do when riding hard the NATO wave. Ffs Europe was building gas pipelines with Russia 3.2 years ago, we’re really still capable of separating ourselves from fascist US, reduce military expenditure with fascist Russia, and take care of our own fascist problems.
Europe isn’t at war with Russia
Yes, we are. From election interference to contamination of drinking water at military bases in Germany, incendiary devices placed on DHL planes, and cutting undersea cables.
we should be struggling in favour of diplomacy to reduce both our and their military expenditure…
Completely naive. Diplomacy only works from a position of strength.
Russia invaded Georgia. No military help, only diplomacy: Led nowhere.
Russia’s 2014 invasion of Ukraine: No military help, only diplomacy. Two Minsk Accords Russia used to build up their military and Russia then happily broke.
reduce military expenditure with fascist Russia, and take care of our own fascist problems.
Russia is part of Europe. Russia is waging genocide in Europe. North Korean soldiers are murdering in Europe. Putin is our fascist problem and people appeasing Putin are also a part of the problem.
I absolutely agree with this, people really seem to not take Putin seriously enough. Putin is already at war with us; he’s literally had people killed in Moabit and invaded Europe. This is not Nato’s fault, it is blatant aggression from Putin, which we need to respond, and should have responded, to accordingly.
If attacks to civilian infrastructure and election interference are enough to claim war, Germany should be in the first instance at war with the US and Ukraine according to that logic, given the explosion of the Nordstream (much more important and evident than reported drinking water alteration or whatever you claim of DHL planes with incendiary devices). Also, Ukraine should be at war with the US for its interference in the election process in 2014, where the democratically elected leader was toppled in a blatant west-backed coup.
You know what Georgia and Ukraine have in common? They’re in the Russian sphere of influence area and have been for the past century. What’s happening is that the west keeps meddling in the Russian sphere of influence and Russia responds in the only way it can: militarily. Russia exhausted the possibilities of diplomacy with the west, warned repeatedly of the consequences of western-alignment of Ukraine (which, again, was done antidemocratically in 2014). That’s the reason why Russia invaded Ukraine, because its diplomacy, soft power and interference were weaker than those of the west in maintaining a sphere of influence. Believe it or not, history didn’t begin in 2022.
The EU should stop the US-directed meddling in Russia’s sphere of influence, and start building relations with the countries that are actually sharing a continent with it. It’s just too racist and too subservient to US interests to do so.
Putin is our fascist problem and people appeasing Putin are also a part of the problem.
Putin is a fascist and that’s a problem, but he’s not the one pushing to cut our healthcare and education and pensions budgets, he does that in Russia. He’s not the one threatening our minorities and our women, he does that in Russia. Europe is more than capable of having fascism by itself without the help of Putin, and blaming everything on a Russian conspiracy is, well, a conspiracy. Russia isn’t nearly powerful or influential enough to be mostly responsible for the fascist problem in the EU, there are a lot more material conditions thst give raise to that.
Stop fucking cheering for war. Stop your warmongering attitudes, stop presenting Europe as the fighting ground for WW3, you DO NOT WANT to see war in the EU, and it’s absofuckinglutely not too late to go back.
Also, Ukraine should be at war with the US for its interference in the election process in 2014, where the democratically elected leader was toppled in a blatant west-backed coup.
And here you are, laying bare that you’re just repeating pro Russian propaganda. Calling the right to protest a coup. Not the occupation of Crimea and Eastern Ukraine is the problem but the people rising up.
He’s not the one threatening our minorities and our women, he does that in Russia.
Yeah, Russia is just there doing some domestic stuff we don’t need to care about. Russia isn’t occupying parts of Ukraine, Moldova, and Georgia. Russia isn’t expanding westwards. Just sit idly by when tens of thousands of non-Russian children get kidnapped, put into reeducation camps, to then fight for Russia. Just sit idly by when Russian agents outright attack German barracks and twiddle your thumbs. Other issues are way more important than caring about that campaign of extermination in Eastern Europe within the borders of an EU-aspirant.
stop presenting Europe as the fighting ground for WW3
Good I didn’t do it. Another Russian propaganda tool is to push back against claims that were never made, acting as if anyone but Russia was the aggressor, trying to move the conversation into Russia’s genocide being just legitimate self-defense.
You’re nothing but a Russian propagandist, whether you’re aware of it or not.
“But wouldn’t a Russian propagandist deny that bad things are happening inside Russia?” the propaganda playbook would make you ask in return, admitting to some criticism but brush it off as a domestic problem far away, trying to cast doubts on your underlying intentions. Russia’s propagandists up the illusion of a broader political landscape. Put the AfD on Germany’s far right, put the BSW on Germany’s far left, put appeasers somewhere in between, and divert attention away from Russia’s attempts at conquering Europe.
Seeing as you’re radicalised against Russia to that degree, any further discussion is useless, I won’t change your mind and you won’t change mine by making false claims of genocide and failing to understand the slightest nuance beyond US state department propaganda
It is so fucking sad that the tolerance “paradox” goes all the way to fucking war.
Like you literally have to fight a war against war seekers if you don’t want war. Like fucking hell, why can’t we at least be chill there?
Not on purpose?
That Baerbock is a horrible warmonger
De-Nazification never happened.
*in west Germany
The Stasi had it’s share of fascist turncoats.
Insignificant compared to west germamy
And a lot more hanged Nazis.
AfD has a guy called Helferich… A funny translation would be Helperling… I can imagine his role and his recap when they ruined Germany and Europe again.
Sorry - is the Reese’s mug a reference to something I should know about?
Former FCC chairman and piece of shit, Ajit Pai used to have a cartoonishly large Reese’s mug. Could be an old picture and all of the text has been changed.
CEO
of racismMeanwhile on Ich
eiliel:Are we subscribed to the same sub. Dach talks about literally nothing else but politics right now so don’t tell me ich_iel only having like 1/3rd political posts today is some kind of smoking gun.
So many people have this misreading: it’s ich_iel (im echten Leben, in reallife) not eil
I thought it looked weird. Thanks friend!
The best pepe
